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Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

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 Author:    Posted: Sep. 8, 2002   This Page Viewed: 9,654,608  

Vox Q Stats

Times Viewed: 32,767

Reponses: 258

Lurker/Post Ratio: 127 to 1

Question of the Week: 104 - 3/24/2003

Have You Changed Your Mind About the War in Iraq?

Many people were initially for or against the possibility of a war in Iraq. Now that it is a reality and troops are on the ground, have you changed your mind or your position on the war?

Do you think that anti-war protests should cease? Do you think that an even greater divide has opened up between those who hold differing ideologies?

Do you think that the suspension of certain civil liberties for security reasons is appropriate during war time? Do YOU feel safer? Will the world be more secure because of this action?

What – if anything – concerns you the most about the war in Iraq?

 Reponses:   There are 258 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 


War Is A Two Headed Coin Mar 27th. at 5:46:50 pm UTC

RedDusk Hawk (Texas) Age: 17 - Email


First let me say that I have always, in every way, dispised war. In every aspect I find it deplorable and feel incredible sorrow to see that it festers in the minds, breaking out in a mass disease about once every generation. But let's face facts, we've done so much to prevent this war. We've given Saddam more then one oppertunity to surrender or at the very least escape. He has not taken it. Let's also take time and realise that NO WAR is ever started over one thing alone. Dp I agree that Bush is partially trying to finish his father's business...yes. Do I belive that part of this is due to oil "needs"...yes. Do I also belive that we have waisted so much time with Saddam and the Iraqi government that they've become arrogant and decided that we won't retaliate against their aiding of terrorist activitys...YES!! In conclusion let me say this. I hate war, and I do hate that we've become involved in it, but if I were needed in ANY way to fight or defend my county, I would stand beside both my peers and my president at the cost of my life.


I Remain In Favor Of Peace Mar 27th. at 6:44:52 pm UTC

EponaSpirit (Laytonville, CA) Age: 54 - Email


My opinion about this war has not changed. War is outdated, and unnecessary, a huge failure of diplomacy. I do not, however, support continuing protests that disrupt the lives of people who are tryig to maintain their daily commitments. I believe that we have registered our dismay at this action, but now the troops (not all of whom are in favor of this war, but are honoring the commitments that they made) they n ow need our support. The more we support them the faster that they come back, and I believe that they will have fewer causalties (as will the Iraqis) with more good will support than the continued hostile actions that are taking place here.
I do not feel that we will be safer, but, instead that we are breeding an entire generation of terrorists in the world that will hate us and try to attack us whenever and wherever they can.
I do not believe that this war exists for any other reason than to get GWB elected president the next election. He needs to have something like this going on (for this will be a long drawn out battle) to distract the country. I am so ashamed of this country right now, and I just do not know what to do to tell the innocent victims of these powerful men to make it better


NO CHANGE HERE Mar 27th. at 8:00:22 pm UTC

Moon (New York) Age: 41 - Email


I am still against this war. I support the troops and admire them for their dedication but I am horrified at what is going on over there and I think things are going to get worse before they get better. May our troops stay safe. I send blessings to them all. ) O (


Haven't Changed My Mind, This War Is STUPID! Mar 27th. at 8:04:43 pm UTC

Copper Lion (CA, USA) Age: 51 - Email


My intial feelings regarding the American invasion of Iraq was that it was unnecessary, without validation and just plain stupid. Unnecessary because if the point was to "get rid of Saddam Husein" and our Military is as state-of-the-art and powerful as they claim to be, why not send a special forces team in there and just kill him? This would save us and the rest of the world the loss of thousands (maybe millions) of innocent lives. Without validation, because as wicked as Saddam may be, Iraq has not attacked the USA (Bush has either forgotten or convieniently ignored the fact that most of those that attacked the World Trade Center were Saudi Arabians, not one of 'em was from Iraq) . In the eyes of most of the rest of the world, this makes us the aggressors. And Stupid because it is galvanizing a large part of the world against us. These kinds of feelings are not quickly forgotten, just ask anyone from Ireland how much they love the English. My opinion is unchanged at this moment. As to the issue of whether this is creating a greater divide between people of differant ideologies. You bet it is! Our administrations attitude towards Islamic nations is obviously growing more antagonistic by the day, and they are responding in kind. Let's not mention the numerous public statements by various "Christian" leaders in this country that have belittled and slandered other peoples beliefs. I read somewhere ther are close to a billion Muslims worldwide, and we as Americans should keep in mind the fact that we (with approx 300 million people) comprise only approx. 6% of the total world population.I personnally do not feel safer, as we systematically piss of other countries (some whom hated our guts to begin with, and don't need an excuse to do something nasty to us) our "brilliant" commander-in-chief has sent most of our military force to the other side of the world on this idiodic crusade of his. Does this make any of you out there in TV land feel safer? What concerns me most about the war in Iraq is not that we will loss (my feeling is we will win That particullar conflict) , but that it is stirring up a hornets nest across the world and the consequences may not be immediately obvious. In closing let me bring up a skeleton from our recent national memory. At the height of the Vietnam War we had close to 1/2 a million military personnel over there and at the time we were considered to be one of the most powerfull military forces on the earth. We got our butts kicked by a small third world country.


Moon Said It Well. Mar 27th. at 10:46:11 pm UTC

Jervamp (Illinois) Age: 28 - Email


I am still against the war. I feel that we have no call to be there right now. But by the same token, I hope that we as a people do not repeat the errors of a generation ago. The soldiers of Vietnam were welcomed hope to spitting, curses, and screaming. I hope that this is not the greeting that these troops will get. I feel that most individuals there don't want to be there any more than many of us want them to be there. They have something that they have to do and they are going to do it. I admire their resolve as individuals to persevere in the face of horrors, while shaking my head in dismay at the leaders that send them there. Let's not forget to ask the Goddess and God to keep the warriors on both sides from harm. The Iraqi people stand to loose the most. Blessed be.


$.02 Mar 28th. at 2:10:58 am UTC

lilith (lost angeles) Age: 33 - Email


i havent changed a jot in my opinion about this war. i dont care how fast it is, i dont care how many lives are spared, i dont care if saddam hussein is a "bad guy"-- it is utterly morally wrong, and i am sorry i have seen the day this country became an unprovoked aggressor in a war against a third world country that oh, just happens to sit on a really big oil field.

i do not feel any safer-- if anything i feel less safe, but not from terrorists or iraq-- i feel less safe from my own government, which is approaching a total eradication of the ideals this country stands for.

people should continue to dissent and protest. just because a war started does not mean you shut up and stop thinking because it might effect the troops. if we really support our troops we dont want them engaged in this kind of nightmare to begin with. this has nothing to do with the troops, and incidentally, most of the soldiers who returned from vietnam never heard s**t from anyone-- the spitting and namecalling were isolated incidents that the administration is really happy to blow out of proportion in order to paint all protestors and peace activists with the same hateful brush. if we support the troops we will protest the war, because the best thing one can do with an army is NEVER USE IT. the idea that we all have to get in line and back the president or else we are those few angry hippies who called soldiers babykillers is absurd. [one more thing-- quite a few civilians WERE murdered by our troops in vietnam, so its not like the emotion was far fetched or anything. it just wasnt a very constructive emotion. it missed the point entirely and took it out on the wrong people. kinda like the hate i have seen poured out on people exercising their constitutional right to free speech and political dissent really misses the point, which is without debate and dissent and the right to do it we dont have a free country and there is really no point to the rule of law.]

this illegitimate presidency has wrought a terrible thing in an attempt to secure oil futures for its supporters, and to secure the next election. the worst thing we could do is to stop protesting. when the war is over protests should continue.


Distinctions Within The Continuum Of Peace And War... Mar 28th. at 2:31:45 am UTC

Cleopatra (Los Angeles, California) Age: 24 - Email


I must say I do have a severely divided belief between peace and war.

For one, I am for the war as our only resort to aid the people under the dictatorship of Iraq and consequently that which they have been enduring for too many generations. Imagine, if you will, living in a dictatorship patriarchically controlled to such an extreme that what you think could cost you and your family their lives? Islam is a beautiful religion, as I feel all religions are. However, when anything is interpreted to an extreme, the inverse of it purpose is more probable than possible. And the proportion which can and has in the past manifested can be so volatile as to create an unhealthy environment for a country to prosper in all aspects.

Further, I also feel the war our country has waged with Iraq has many facets in its intention. To be more specific the war is dedicated to erasing terrorist beliefs and actions against the United States INCLUDING the rest of the world. To forget this is to lose focus on humanity. Oil may be the Bush factor, indeed, but we must remember other nations' approval whether they make this a public notice or not. No one, I don't care what race, creed or spiritual path you follow wants to see terrorism inflicted on others. However we cannot deny the fact that a democracy as the most credible governmental structure in this century, based on the fact that other nations have welcomed our method, pure and simple.

For example, we cannot forget Usama bin Laden's connection to the Taliban and the control it exerted over Afghanistan. This country had an established government of which the Taliban took over and instilled policies that forbade women and children from everything including READING & WRITING!!! Educated women who were doctors, judges and attorneys were banned from practice, became homeless overnight, lying in the streets, begging for change with which they could only do while covered with a burka from head to toe! Our military single-handedly controlled and eradicated the Taliban and drove them out of office while reinstating the President of Afghanistan along with their former government. Women and children are permitted an education and to work, like everyone else now -- they are a liberated people.

We must remember that within any point of view, either religiously or spritually we have a majority group who always seem to have more influence over the masses; but also within the masses are a minority who always seem to take the rap from outside groups who, for whatever reason, seem to think the groups' beliefs as a whole are homogenous. This is the furthest from the truth. This is what taints our opinions and convolutes our judgements in helping oppressed nations. For pete's sake, we are the most powerful country in the world! If not to use this to help others in need, than for what?

My point here is that without war we have no peace. For how are we to distinguish what is peace without the experience of war? What right do we have to decide, as humans are limited beings, to be so foolish as to think we know exactly what war is? Or peace for that matter? We should be grateful to those we believe in for what we have and who we are. We should be thankful to everything around us including the negative and embrace it without prejudice or malice so as to teach us and help us learn the ways of the world...for life is cyclical after all.


Who Are You? Mar 28th. at 3:03:21 am UTC

Belisamasana (Wausau, Wisconsin) Age: 33 - Email


This is the kind of person that I am.......

If I'm walking down the street and see children picking on another, I walk up and butt in, trying to help the child under torment.

If I'm the first on the scene of a car accident, I stop and offer assistance.

If I see a mother/father abusing their child, I demand they stop and give them a verbal tongue lashing.

If I see a man physically abusing a woman, I step in by calling the police.

If I have a friend that needs help, I will give him/her the shirt off of my back.

I have put myself in danger before to help someone that is in need of help. I am 4'11" and very unassuming, but do not mess with me, because I will take proper channels to protect people in need. I am not violent, but we live in a violent society.....we always have, we are human, and that is human nature. Sure, it would be nice if everyone could get along, but you know that is a dream. I live in this reality, not the fairytale most live in. And for those who think they are "morally superior" because they are against the war, just listen to the FACTS, clear your head, think straight and try not to be so dramatic. It really upsets me when people think we have no right to be there, helping the Iraqi's. What do you do, tune out the "icky" things you hear about Saddam's Regime???? We are stronger, we need to make a sacrifice. Stop protesting and volunteer your time to help others instead of blocking traffic and becomming a nightmare for police who are only trying to protect and serve.


My Opinion Mar 28th. at 8:59:13 am UTC

Walks the Hidden Path (Biddeford, ME) Age: 26 - Email


The war in Iraq was supposed to be a get in, get out, force Saddam to let go type of thing. That was in 1991, when it actually had a point. Now, it is a point of honor between father and son. Bush senior couldn't force Hussein out during his presidency, and when Clinton took over the reins, the war came to an end. This angered many Americans, but they accepted the peace that followed.
Then, September 11 happened. The world got up in an uproar, with good reason, but they lost sight of the real people responsible. Saddam might have allowed these men to live in his country, the material they used and money they spent may have come from his country, but he was not directly responsible, and his people are being punished.
George W. is fulfilling the wish his father made during his last days in office, and because the memories of September 11 are still sore in everyone's mind, he is using that to blame the Muslim people in general, and Saddam Hussein in particular for the events of that day. He has given up on the hunt for Al Qaeda and bin Laden. He has lost sight of the real reason behind the terror attacks.
Bush is using the fear and righteous anger we all feel, and using it to finish what his father could not. Nothing more, nothing less. He is bringing down WW3, and he doesn't even care.
Just look at what he said the protest groups that said not to war were. "Using the opinions of those protesters would be like using the opinions of a focus group to decide world policy." Does that sound like a President that cares about the American people? I think not.
I support the men and women dying over there, but I wholeheartedly oppose the reason they are there in the first place.


NO MORE WAR Mar 28th. at 11:42:14 am UTC

Dylan (Maine USA) Age: 27 - Email


Dear Everyone


I think that Bush has gone too far. This is only a war to spread his control over the world and set things up so he can control things even when not in office. Although I see why some would want to go to war after 9/11, this will only escalate the conflict. It was not a last resort as some claim. Bush went ahead without the UN's approval. More than half of the world is against going to war and still Bush refuses to negotiate. That is my point of view.

Dylan


?? Mar 28th. at 2:43:59 pm UTC

Natalia (madrid) Age: 14 - Email - Web


I think the war is not a way to end problems between countries, the opposite it makes countries angry and causes future problems.Just now a illegal war has began which started the USA by saying that it was to finish with terrorism but which had other secret arrengments like them wanting the petrol.The population is paying for it and lots of people are dying.The allies are not being reasonable and in some countries like Spain, the president and his party is not listening to the people which say that they don´t want a war.This is causing lots of peaceful movements which lately are not that peaceful.People should be able to express their thoughts against war but the problems lately are causing that lots of people to stop going because they are afraid to be hurt in this movements.Aznar listen to your country!!!
NO WAR PLEASE.


No Suspension Of Civil Liberties Mar 28th. at 8:40:23 pm UTC

EponaSpirit (Laytonville, CA) Age: 54 - Email


I forgot to respond to the last part of the question, and that is whether I believe it is appropriate to suspend certain civil liberties for increased safety. Let me quote to you one Benjamin Franklin, of Benjamin Franklin fame. He said "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
And there is nothing that I can say that is superior to that. there is no reason to be giving up any liberties for any reason. The fallacy that we need to do so now because of the threat of terrorism and to increase the information gatherin capacity of the government, my response to that is that the government was not able to use the information that it had, why drown it with more? It had information about potential attacks, that could be legally used and would probably have stopped 9/11, but did not use it. The government is incompetent to protect us with all of our liberties in place, suspending those will only increase our danger.
Thank you


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