Your browser does not support script

Pagan Perspectives

Weekly Question

Question of the Week: 113

Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

Views: [32,767]
Responses: [2,666]

The Rules
Note: The opinions posted on the Pagan Perspective pages are those of individuals and are not neccessarily shared or endorsed by the Witches' Voice inc.

For Further
Visit The

WitchVox List
of 242
'Net Sites:

Chat Boards
Email Lists
IRC Channels

Past Questions
112. Elders: Who Are They and Do We Really Need Them? - [74]

111. So, You’re Dead. Now What? - [59]

110. What’s Your Favorite Element? - [119]

109. The Broom Closet Revisited: What’s Your Current Occupancy Rate? - [129]

108. Do You Speak Pagan Geek? - [38]

107. Would You Be A Good ‘Reality Show’ Contestant? - [49]

106. What Is Your Inner Animal? - [127]

105. Are Pagans TOO Individualistic? - [56]

104. Have You Changed Your Mind About the War in Iraq? - [258]

103. What Are You Reading? - [95]

102. Do Interfaith Conferences/ Discussions Work? - [29]

101. Have You Made Any Extra Security Preparations? - [85]

100. Why Are You A Pagan or Heathen? - [142]

99. What Moon Phase Are You In? - [70]

98. Would You Live In A Haunted House? - [166]

97. What Natural Objects Are On Your Altar? - [103]

96. If You Were Granted Three Wishes... - [179]

95. How Do You Feel About War? - [153]

94. Who Would Make Your Pagan/Heathen Who’s Who List? - [91]

93. Should Pagans Apply For Federal Funds? - [56]

92. What Do You See in 2003? - [47]

90. Which Christmas Ghost Would You Like To Be? - [82]

89. Bah-Humbug! Are You Offended by Christmas? - [173]

88. Are We Alone in The Universe? - [67]

87. The Pagan Web 2002... Your likes? Dislikes? - [50]

86. How’s Your Gratitude Attitude? - [64]

85. What’s Your Motivation? - [97]

84. Between the Veils: What Did You See? - [80]

83. Time to Talk Politics and Elections… - [109]

82. Your Samhain/Beltaine Musings - [50]

81. ExCUSE Me! Has Common Courtesy Become A Thing of the Past? - [97]

80. Polytheist, Monotheist, Dualist or Other? - [104]

79. Have You Switched Pagan Paths? - [110]

78. Would You Take Part in a Public Event or Protest AS a Pagan? - [268]

77. Pot-Kettle: Do We Have Our Own Fundamentalists? - [91]

76. America 911: One Year Later. What's Changed? Are we Safer? - [103]

75. So What Do YOU Think of the Pagan Web? - [43]

74. What is/was your 2002 New Year's resolution - [23]

73. Do You Believe in Faeries? - [44]

72. Is 'Peace on Earth and Good Will Toward Men' Possible? - [28]

71. How Do YOU View the Balance of Light and Dark? - [22]

70. What's News? - [22]

69. What Are Your Favorite Yule Traditions or Memories? - [17]

68. Are You Wild About Harry? - [80]

67. What Is Music? - [18]

66. What Did You Do this Samhain? - [8]

65. What ARE the most "Frequently Asked Questions' About Witches? - [31]

64. What Are YOUR book/video/dvd Recommendations? - [119]

63. Have You Done Any Protection Spells or Workings? - [38]

62. What Are Your Thoughts On The Current "War on Terrorism"? - [77]

61. Are You Willing To Give Up Some Civil Liberties To Be Safe? - [69]

60. What About Those Pagan Leaders Again? - [289]

59. 911 America: Talking Through The Terror... - [969]

58. What Are Your Plans For Fall? - [21]

57. If You Were Stranded Alone On A Deserted Island... - [56]

56. What Would You Like to See at The Voice? - [65]

55. What Lies Beyond? - [28]

54. What is the connection between Spirit, Nature and Humankind? - [18]

53. What is 'Will' or 'Willpower'? - [19]

52. Have you ever been to a Pagan Festival? - [26]

51. What Did You Think of 'The Mists of Avalon"? - [44]

50. What's Your Magickal Focus? - [33]

49. Ending Religious Discrimination-What's It Gonna Take? - [41]

48. How Fares The First Amendment? - [20]

47. Are you a Talker or a Listener? - [14]

46. Predator and Prey - What Beasts Live Within You? - [44]

45. Who Do You Trust? - [22]

44. Do You Spend Money with Pagan Merchants? - [24]

43. What's On Your Balloon? - [52]

42. Is There An Energy Crisis? - [30]

41. What Makes You So Special? - [33]

40. What is Your Guilty Little Secret? - [101]

39. Who Are Your Gods? - [55]

38. What Are The Greatest Challenges That Pagans Face Today? - [35]

37. What's On Your Altar? - [45]

36. Should the United States Apologize to China - [32]

35. Pagan Web Surfing Likes/Dislike - [60]

34. What Are Your Views on Abortion, Euthanasia and Suicide? - [95]

33. What Is The Appropriate Response to Bigotry and Religious Hatred? - [108]

32. Why Are Kids Killing Kids? - [60]

31. Whassa Matter With Kids Today? - [71]

30. What Do You Support and Why Do You Support It? - [21]

29. How About Some New Holidays? - [39]

28. Where Did You Get Your Magickal Name? - [93]

27. Where Are The Pagan Social Programs? Do We Care? - [22]

26. What Do You Think About Bush's 'Faith-Based' Initiative Plan? - [87]

25. What Are The Boundaries? - [26]

24. What is Pagan History and What is Pagan Belief? - [44]

23. Who or What is a "Pagan Leader"? - [61]

22. What More Do You Want To Know About Paganism? - [45]

21. What is/was your New Year's resolution? - [19]

19. What do YOU of our newest entry into the Presidential Political Pool? - [61]

20. What have YOU done to trace your family history? - [11]

18. Your Gift, Craft and Holiday Celebration Ideas! - [43]

17. Does Older Equal Better? - [199]

16. What is the best gift that you ever received? - [28]

15. What are YOU Thankful For? - [87]

14. The Unresolved US Election - [263]

13. Divination - [29]

12. Pagan Choice for the y2k US Election - [129]

11. Hollywood Hype - [74]

10. Money and the Craft - [82]

9. Pagan Jokes and Humorous Stories - [37]

8. Misconceptions About Witches, Wiccans and Pagans - [63]

7. The Ethics of Magick and Spellwork - [43]

6. What are YOU planning for Mabon-Autumn Equinox? - [14]

5. Pagan books/web sites-dynamic or drivel? - [46]

4. The Broomcloset-In or Out?... What's YOUR View? - [181]

3. Church and State, Religion in School... What is YOUR View? - [122]

2. How Do You Define Witch/WitchCraft? - [42]

1. Who are you going to vote for and why? - [233]

 Author:    Posted: Sep. 8, 2002   This Page Viewed: 22,815,877  

Vox Q Stats

Times Viewed: 32,767

Reponses: 32

Lurker/Post Ratio: 1023 to 1

Question of the Week: 36 - 4/9/2001

Should the United States Apologize to China

Hopefully, the tense situation between China and the U.S. will resolved soon and the flight crew will come home. Should the United States apologize to help make that happen? Both sides state that the other side is at fault. Is it national pride, administration politics or just plain stubbornness at work here? Both countries came out early with the saber rattling. Did they both say too much, too soon and now must 'save face' and not back away from that position? How do Pagans in other countries view this incident? Does pride really cometh before a fall? Is principle or practicality more important in certain situations? If you were running things, what would YOU do?

 Reponses:   There are 32 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 

The Way The News Came Out Here In South Africa Made It... Apr 11th. at 10:29:57 am EDT

Aquila (Johannesburg, South Africa) Age: 41 - Email

The way the news came out here in South Africa made it absolutely clear that (in our journalists' opinions) the USA had been on a spying mission and had presumably wiped out the Chinese pilot, and was now making ridiculous aggressive noises at China!
Myself, I'm a dyed-in-the-wool anarchist, and I thought I disliked all governments equally......until George Dubya came along. Somehow he manages to display a horrifying image of arrogance made so much worse by rank ignorance.
I don't like politicians, but the President of the USA takes the biscuit!
As several people have already pointed out, just how would America react if the boot were on the other foot? Methinks you'd be at war already!

Sigh* I Guess My Post Was One Of The Ones Erased. I... Apr 11th. at 2:41:21 pm EDT

KaLee (Ripley, West Virginia US) Age: 14 - Email

*Sigh* I guess my post was one of the ones erased. I hope I can remember what all I posted. Here is goes again:

I am glad this question was asked. I was found a few days ago, screaming at the TV "JUST APOLOGIZE ALREADY!" . If a grown man cannot get over his pride and say two simple word to get our AMERICAN men back on our AMERICAN soil, no matter whose fault it is, then scoot over Dubya, I am taking over. No, it probably wasn't our fault. Or, if it was, it was certainly an accident. But there are our people over there, with families and friends. People who could be being tortured right now for government secrets. People who could die just for two words and a giant stick up our President's ass. George, you are not going to die just because you have to apologize, but there are good men over there who might. Stop being such a child.

So We Were Spying. No Big Revelation There. We Spy On Them... Apr 11th. at 6:43:02 pm EDT

Jeff (Havre de Grace, Maryland US) Age: 43

So we were spying. No big revelation there. We spy on them and they spy on us. Our plane was in international airspace. The Chinese were playing an old game similar to the games the Soviet Union would play. A cat-and-mouse game with big hardware capable of resulting in the death of someone. All sides play this game. The Chinese would have loved nothing more than to provoke the US into making a mistake which they could come back on us. Well they messed up. A show of regret is all that is required. An appology would place the US in a bad position resulting in lawsuits and possible prision for the crew - in CHINA. Also the crew is well aware of the risks involved with the job. G.W., as much as I hate to say it, performed as his duty as Commander-In-Chief demanded of him.

Repost: Yeah All Countries Spy On One Another. That Is Just A... Apr 11th. at 10:32:28 pm EDT

Autumn SilverFerret (Montoursville, Pennsylvania US) Age: 22 - Email

Repost: Yeah all countries spy on one another. That is just a cold fact. As another post said we got caught. I think Bush should get past his pride and apologize, if that's what it takes to get those American citizens home, then so be it. For a man who doesn't even believe that my religion is real, he certainly doesn't follow his own. He doesn't seem to hold those human lives as sacred or he would apologize. Instead he risks theirs for a silly little spat. Don't get me wrong I love this country. We have a written constitution, some countries don't. We have certain freedoms that others don't. And I honor and respect the people who fought for those freedoms and are still fighting. An apology couldn't hurt to bring those people home to their families. We are grownups and if we let this petty dispute get in the way of bringing those people home then there is definitely something wrong with this country. For too long we've been playing watchdog to other countries when it's not our business. Other countries dislike us Americans for that very reason. It's time we backed down. Just because another country has a different system of government than we do, our government feels it must step in. That system works for them. Ours works for us. If we were in China's position we would be demanding the same thing if not more. We'd be screaming for blood. We killed their pilot not the other way around. In short apologize, apologize, apologize!

Love and Light!


The U.s. Should Use This As An Opportunity To Get The Truth... Apr 13th. at 2:39:41 am EDT

Dream (here, Michigan US) Age: 30 - Email

The U.S. should use this as an opportunity to get the truth into the open: we will continue to spy on you until you disarm, as we expect you will continue to spy on us. Does this change anything? Maybe. You have proved yourselves decent enough to return our people to us. Now we have to find a way to prove ourselves as hospitable/decent/human as you.

Never stop working for a better world.

In Today's World, Covert Intelligence Or Spying Is Not Only Common, It... Apr 13th. at 8:26:58 am EDT

Frank (Okeechobee, Florida US) Age: 32 - Email

In today's world, covert intelligence or spying is not only common, it is a requirement if we are to ensure national security. It's nasty business and opens up doors to all kinds of problems. I know allot of us would like to see it go the way of the dinosaurs, but sadly, it will not. As for the apology, things go deeper than just saying, "Hey look man, I'm sorry." In countrys like China, the word "Apology" carries more than just the common sentiments of regret. If the U.S. were to fromally apologize, we are in fact saying, "We accept full responsibility, it was all our fault and our honor is less because of it." Saying things like "Im sorry" and "We apologize" are very serious phrases when it comes to diplomacy and world affairs. Sadly, relations on this scale cannot be so easily or innocently managed. There are no easy or universally agreeable approaches to this problem, what must be done is a careful analysis of the situation and a mutually agreeable solution. Remember, the government of China must save face, like it or not. Were they to allow us to just saunter in thier country and just run things, they would lose respect and standing in thier country and in the world. That's not only unacceptable, it can be dangerous on a global scale. Personally, I think this whole thing was handled the best way it could have been, considering who we were dealing with. As for the President, when it comes to things like this, I'm thankful that people like Colin Powell and the Vice President are on the team. President Bush is just not seasoned enough to deal with countries like China, they have no respect for him. He's unproven. Cheney and Powell are differnt. China respects Cheney's experience and his ability. As for Powell, we all know who really solved this mess in China, and so does he. When you look at Powell, think "President", after all, he will have that title one day.

Having Spent Over 20 Years In The Military Defending Our Freedom Of... Apr 13th. at 10:14:41 pm EDT

Carlee (Denver, Colorado US) Age: 40

Having spent over 20 years in the military defending our freedom of religion, among other things....the last thing Bush should do is apologize. The aircrew would not want it, and accepting responsibility would leave the crew open for prosecution by the Chinese! Remember, this is a very different culture, and not a free one as ours is. (However, Dubbya got a little too arrogant at the start...and made the situation worse) Thank the Goddess the crew is home safe - props don't fly well when you lose two engines on one side!!

I Don't Really Believe The United States Should Have Had Their Spy... Apr 14th. at 3:32:08 pm EDT

Joseph Hancock (Maple Creek, Saskatchewan CA) Age: 41

I don't really believe the United States should have had their spy plane over in that part of the world when it is supposed to be at peace with the People's Republic of China. This may fly in the face of a lot of people but I do think that if an apology is owed then the US should be first to tender it. I also think it would be appropriate for China to also apologize, both parties to shake hands, and both try to live a little more peacefully after this. Blame or fault is generally on both sides of these incidents but I think the United States spy plane triggered the incident.

 1    2    3  

Pagan Essays

Pagan Web
8,000 Links

Pagan Groups
Local Covens etc.

80,000 Profiles

Home - TWV Logos - Email US - Privacy
News and Information

Chapters: Pagan/Heathen Basics - Pagan BOOKS - Traditions, Paths & Religions - Popular Pagan Holidays - TV & Movies - Cats of the Craft - Festival Reviews - Festival Tips - White Pages (Resources) - Issues/Concerns - West Memphis 3 - Witch Hunts - Pagan Protection Tips - Healing Planet Earth

Your Voices: Adult Essays - Young Pagan Essays - Pagan Perspectives (On Hold) - WitchWars: Fire in the Craft - Gay Pagan - Pagan Parenting - Military - Pagan Passages

Pagan Music: Pagan Musicians - Bardic Circle at WitchVox - Free Music from TWV

Vox Central: About TWV - Wren: Words, Wrants and Wramblings - Guest Rants - Past Surveys - A Quest for Unity

Weekly Updates: Click HERE for an index of our weekly updates for the past 6 years

W.O.T.W. - World-Wide Networking

Your Town: A Link to YOUR Area Page (The largest listing of Witches, Pagans, Heathens and Wiccans on the Planet)

VoxLinks: The Pagan Web: 8,000 Listings

Your Witchvox Account: Log in Now - Create New Account - Request New Password - Log in Problems

Personal Listings: Pagan Clergy in Your Town - Adult Pagans - Young Pagans - Military Pagans

Events: Circles, Gatherings, Workshops & Festivals

Covens/Groups/Orgs: Local Groups Main Page

Other LOCAL Resources: Local Shops - Regional Sites - Local Notices - Global/National Notices - Local Skills & Services - Local Egroups - Political Freedom Fighters

Pagan Shopping: Online Shops Index - Original Crafters Sites - Auction Sites - Pagan Wholesalers - Pagan Local Shops

Web Site Content (including: text - graphics - html - look & feel)
Copyright 1997-2019 The Witches' Voice Inc. All rights reserved
Note: Authors & Artists retain the copyright for their work(s) on this website.
Unauthorized reproduction without prior permission is a violation of copyright laws.

Website structure, evolution and php coding by Fritz Jung on a Macintosh.

Any and all personal political opinions expressed in the public listing sections
(including, but not restricted to, personals, events, groups, shops, Wren’s Nest, etc.)
are solely those of the author(s) and do not reflect the opinion of The Witches’ Voice, Inc.
TWV is a nonprofit, nonpartisan educational organization.

The Witches' Voice carries a 501(c)(3) certificate and a Federal Tax ID.

Mail Us: The Witches' Voice Inc., P.O. Box 341018, Tampa, Florida 33694-1018 U.S.A.