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Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

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1. Who are you going to vote for and why? - [233]



















 Author:    Posted: Sep. 8, 2002   This Page Viewed: 9,249,082  

Vox Q Stats

Times Viewed: 32,767

Reponses: 233

Lurker/Post Ratio: 140 to 1

Question of the Week: 1 - 8/7/2000

Who are you going to vote for and why?

Which political platform or candidate are you leaning towards? Do you think that a level of political involvement is important to pagans? Are you registered to vote, will you vote and who -if you don't mind telling the world- are you planning to vote for (or against)?

 Reponses:   There are 233 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 


I Am Wondering What Is The Canidates Position On Paganism/ Wicca. I... Aug 7th. at 1:19:47 pm UTC

Sara Hickey (Vallejo, California US) Age: 26 - Email


I am wondering what is the canidates position on Paganism/ Wicca. I am pretty sure that Bush does not recognize Wicca as a religion (ie. in the military). I could never vote for some one of that opinion! I have yet to see anything about Gore or his running mate. Where can I find this information?


You Can't Be Heard Unless You Speak Up! We Pagans Have Become... Aug 7th. at 1:33:03 pm UTC

Carey Oxler (Kansas City, Missouri US) Age: 21 - Email


You can't be heard unless you SPEAK UP! We pagans have become so used to silence being our protection, that maybe we've let that seep into our voting perspective. I have been disillusioned, like everyone else, by the farce that is our current "two"-party system. Ralph Nader has proven he's not a puppet for corporations that care more about making money than their employees or consumers. Forgive the length of this rant, inspired by the incredible Dennis Miller...

What has happened to our political system? Since when have our political leaders been passed around like hot baseball rookies: the special interest group who offers the juiciest contract wins? I donÕt mean to get off on a rant here, but our current democratic process is about as close to what our founding fathers had in mind as George W. Bush is to getting into Mensa.

Which makes me wonder. Why arenÕt more of our leaders gifted with at least the intelligence and common sense of your average post-seizure teacup poodle? Come on, people. Dan Quayle was nothing more than assassination insurance for George. I donÕt care what your terrorist agenda was, having Danny BoyÕs finger on the button is the stuff of chalupa-and-ice-cream-induced nightmares.

The Chinese had a system by which the peasants could improve their station in society: run for public office. The trick was getting past the rigorous written exams. Your average peasant couldnÕt get the cowrie shells together to bribe the proctor, so occasionally some guys made it through on intelligence and ability. Good thing Mao took care of that.

As Americans, weÕve proven we canÕt choose competent leaders by popularity. It didnÕt work for the highschool Student Council, and itÕs not working here. Your average American canÕt tell a political leader from a pro-wrestler, but they can look at sports statistics and know that the higher the number, the better the player. LetÕs get odds on these guys before we place our bets.

Forget party lines- Bill has to pick a card when he gets up in the morning to determine what his political alignment will be for the day. I say we require that IQ, Emotional Intelligence, general political aptitude, psychological profiles, and international protocol savvy scores be posted on the ballots next to their names. Hmm. Candidate A is a pathological liar, but Candidate B doesnÕt know where Uruguay is on a map. This might be a little more informative then knowing whether they prefer Pepsi or Coke after boffing an intern.

And I want this standardized. No NRA cardholder extra credit points. And I want as much of it put onto a computer as possible. Go ahead and put a slot in the terminal for bribes, because if you donÕt theyÕll just break something trying to do it anyways. Maybe we could put the money toward our educational institutions that produce politicians dumb enough to try to bribe a machine...

But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong...

Is it just me, or have Americans become so used to government corruption that they no longer vote honestly, just what they think they can get away with? I have asked lots of people who they're voting for, and they all say they hate George and Al, but that they "don't want to throw their vote away..."

You have a voice, you have a conscience. Try voting for someone with the balls to stand up to corrupt corporations without taking bribes. Try voting for someone who has ACTED on his convictions. Try voting for someone who will do what he can to make sure our children will live healthy lives. Try voting for someone who hasn't been groomed for a political career for his entire natural life.

And if you haven't been there yet, got to www.votenader.com

Email Me! I actually write back! Carey_Kat@hotmail.com


I Have No Fantasy That Ralph Nader Will Be Elected President, Or... Aug 7th. at 1:42:03 pm UTC

Stardust (Lubbock, Texas US) Age: 20


I have no fantasy that Ralph Nader will be elected president, or even recieve a single electoral vote, but I will still vote my concious. I agree with many parts of the Green Party platform and of naders own views, and am casting my vote (yes, I'm already registered) that way because I feel at least I am showing America my opinion. Most likely I believe that Bush will win because he has a much greater appeal to the "general populance" that Gore. Bush is a better speaker and is so far has run a better campaign (in my opinion). My view may be colored because I live in a very conservative part of Texas. I see the next four years as being a struggle for American pagans.


I Believe That A High Level Of Political Involvement Is Important To... Aug 7th. at 1:58:52 pm UTC

Nathan (Wichita, Kansas US) Age: 19 - Email


I believe that a high level of political involvement is important to pagans, not to make america a "pagan" nation, because in a way it already is a pagan nation with all the different religions represented under that flag. I don't want a "pagan" america how we describe paganism, I just want an america. I am not registered to vote yet, but believe me I will be soon. I think allthough Nader is a fat chance I will be voting for him, call me a cynic, but I think the current two party system has gone far enough.... and that just isn't far enough.


At This Point, I'm Leaning Heavily Towards Ralph Nader And The Green... Aug 7th. at 3:35:49 pm UTC

Quicksilver (Denton, Texas US) Age: 40 - Email


At this point, I'm leaning heavily towards Ralph Nader and the Green Party, and most likely will be voting that way in November (and yes, I'm already registered). I do believe that Pagans should be politically aware and involved--particularly in this election, where the right to follow our own spiritual path is being called into question. This is, of course, a hard thing to do, most of us have pretty full cups as it is. But everyone, Pagan and non-Pagan, should be involved in the political process--even if your involvement only extends to stuffing envelopes for the candidate of your choice. It is primarily the apathy of the American people as a whole that has allowed the political system to become the current mess we have on our hands now. No one wants to be bothered with having to think or--Goddess forbid!--DO anything, which just leaves the door open for Bush, or anyone else with their own little agendas, to come in and set up camp.

I couldn't resist peeking at the other posts before adding my own 2 cents, and I was dismayed (although not really surprised) by some of what I read. To those of you who say you would like to vote for Nader (or any other 3rd party candidate), but won't because you don't think he has a chance of winning, I say: vote your conscience. I'll repeat--Vote Your Conscience. One more time (because I'm Celtic): VOTE YOUR CONSCIENCE! If everyone who SAYS that they'd like to see Nader (or whoever) win, would actually put their money (or vote) where their mouth is, he MIGHT just win the election. And even if he didn't, you'd at least have a legitimate right to gripe when Bush or Gore screw things up :) The only vote that is "thrown away" is the vote you cast against your true convictions just because you want to back the "winning team."

OK...I'll get off my soapbox now.


I'm Democratic All The Way. Wiccan/pagan Republican (conservitive) Is An Oxymoron... Aug 7th. at 3:41:05 pm UTC

Raven Taylor (Springfield, Massachusetts US) Age: 22 - Email


I'm democratic all the way. Wiccan/Pagan Republican (Conservitive) is an oxymoron as far as I'm concerned. I mena, how can you believe in what Wicca teaches and vote for a party that not only denies that your religion is valid, but is backed by the religious right that can't wait to try and mash our faith into the ground (good luck!) Abortion rights, Gay rights, and minority rights are directly tied in with our rights as Pagans, as they all consist of the right to exist and live happy on theis planet, and also to have conroll over ourself and your choices. The liberal parties generaly back these ideals all the way. And if you are wiccan and vote for george bush...(I'm going to say something VERY unlike me) then I think you shouldn't be calling yourself wiccan. This man came out in time magazine and said paganism and wicca are not real religions (He also backs bob barr on this).

Sorry if this is offensive, but it'smy opinion.


I Am Most Definitely Registered To Vote, And I Find Myself Leaning... Aug 7th. at 3:42:58 pm UTC

Seabhac (Concord, California US) Age: 27


I am most definitely registered to vote, and I find myself leaning away from Governor Bush - I object to his conservative leanings and ties to the religious right. Unfortunately, Gore seems to be little better, but that could simply be my native cynicism with regards to politics. I will be making my decision in the months to come, but I plan on reading up on *all* of the candidates before stepping into the polling booth.

And yes, I firmly believe that there is a necessity to be aware (at the very least) of politics and political trends. For example, without at least a minimum level of involvement, there wouldn't have been the outcry there was when Rep. Bob Barr made some of his outrageous statements. And now, with the presidential elections happening in less than three months, a president will be elected - a man (unfortunately this county isn't ready for a woman president) who will have the power to appoint officials and justices, who will in turn determine how the laws of this country will affect everyone in it. Everything has repercussions, and pagans are more aware of this than the average voter. If we don't vote, we allow others to make choices for us, to take responsibility for what happens for the next four years in this country. We need to be aware, and we should take it upon ourselves to be active and aware in the political arena.


I Have Been Registered To Vote Since Before My 18th Birthday. I... Aug 7th. at 3:48:36 pm UTC

Faith (Columbus, Ohio US) Age: 22


I have been registered to vote since before my 18th birthday. I have always read the current political issues and been very aware of how our government works.

I'm still undecided on which candidate I will vote for. I was leaning heavily toward Gore, but now that he's announced his running mate, I'm back to the undecided category. Honestly, I'm a little disappointed in Al Gore's choice for VP. Sen. Lieberman is one of three Senators who started a rampage against the media, blaming television, the internet, and video games for the Columbine killings. Not to mention the fact Liberman advocates censorship for television, radio, video games and just about any platform he can think of which could "influence" children to violence.

Bush is definitely one that I worry about if elected to office. Advocating "Jesus Day" in his state is completely one- sided. Also in several of his speeches, he commonly refers to God. So even if he was tolerant of other religions (I'm still unsure of this), I am *positive* that he is completely intolerant of religions which have more than one deity, not to mention a religion that places great emphasis on a female deity as well!

The victor of this campaign will have a very powerful hold over the country; especially if he gets to appoint Supreme Court Justices. I'm really not sure which platform is the lesser of two evils: religious bigotry or media censorship? United States citizens are guaranteed the right to practice religious rights without persecution and the right of free speech, and free press or has this government changed the public's Constitutional rights and not informed anyone?

This election (as with every other election- Presidential or not) is extremely important, not only for Pagans, but any American who doesn't want to be denied the freedom granted to us by the document which protects all of its citizens. We, as a nation, need to be more vocal and tell the constituents what *we want*, rather than clapping in response to what the candidates tell us what *we should want*.


I Will Probably Vote For Harry Browne, The Libertarian Candidate. It Appears... Aug 7th. at 4:21:04 pm UTC

Kevin (Nevada, Missouri US) Age: 21


I will probably vote for Harry Browne, the Libertarian candidate. It appears that the libertarians (more than any other party) are in favor of religious freedom and separation of church and state, not to mention a minimalist gov't.

As to pagan political involvement, the only reason I'd get involved (as a pagan and not as a citizen) is if my rights were about to be trod upon by J. Random Fundie Politician, whether $POL wants the gov't to discriminate against pagans or if it wants to weaken the separation of church and state.

I am indeed registered to vote, and definitely will. As I said, I will likely vote for Harry Browne and the Libertarians, and against the rather calcified Republicratic party and its candidates. I dislike both of the major US presidential candidates and wish people would *open their eyes*. Republicans wishing to appear as the party of diversity? {snort} That's called trolling for votes. The Democrats are little better, in my eyes.

If not Harry Browne, I would vote for Jesse Ventura or John McCain if they were candidates -- at least they're willing to speak their minds and buck the System. They even seem honest, a rare quality in politicians /anywhere/.


I've Never Voted Straight-ticket Anything, Much To My Family's Dismay, (very Political... Aug 7th. at 4:46:58 pm UTC

Stephanie Stanton (New Orleans, Louisiana US) Age: 45 - Email


I've never voted straight-ticket anything, much to my family's dismay, (very political family). Have never missed voting in any election either, no matter how small and seemingly irrelevant. It's very important for W/P/W's to get involved in the political process and vote. The politico's hold our right to worship openly in their hands. Have not yet decided who I'm voting for, but I know who I'm voting against. George W. Bush is not, under any circumstances, Pagan-friendly. Proclaiming a "Jesus Day", and his interview on ABC concerning the Fort Hood Wiccans clearly showed where he stands. I'll just say "NO" to Bush. I had respect for his father, but the son is not the father.


I Am Voting Libertarian. And Frankly I Must Say I Am Surprised... Aug 7th. at 4:51:36 pm UTC

Blue Hawk (Lake Villa, Illinois US) Age: 20 - Email


I am voting Libertarian.

And frankly I must say I am surprised more Pagans are not Libertarian. It is the only political party that I have heard of that wants to make government smaller not bigger. It is the only political party that will give you back you freedom by reducing government, getting the government out of you life.

As Harry Browne says (http://www.harrybrowne2000.org/): (begin quote)

I Want You to Be Free

I am running for President because I want you to be free . . .

Free to live your life as you think it should be lived, not as Al Gore or George W. Bush thinks you should live it;

Free to raise your children by your values, not those of some far-off bureaucrat who sees your children as foot soldiers in a plan to create a Brave New World;

Free to keep every dollar you earn - and spend it, save it, give it away as you think best, not as the politicians will allow after they've spent what they want.

George W. Bush, Al Gore, Pat Buchanan, and Ralph Nader are arguing over one basic issue: which one is best qualified to run your life? Which one knows best what kind of school your child should attend? Which one knows how your health-insurance company should treat you? Which one knows best how to organize the economy, determine how much of your own money you should be allowed to keep, and decide what is a proper way for you to live?

I am running because I don't believe they are capable of running your life. I don't believe I am capable of running your life. I believe only you know best how to run your life.

(end quote)

Check out the Libertarian website (http://www.harrybrowne2000.org/) if you really want to vote for someone who will protect your freedoms as laid down by the Constitution, including the freedom to worship as you please.

Those of you who want to vote for a third party candidate but feel like it is "throwing away your vote", isn't it throwing away your vote to vote for someone you do not believe should be president? In my opinion you are better off not voting then voting for someone you do not believe in.

Blessed Be all,


In My Heart I Believe In The Constitution One Of The Greatest... Aug 7th. at 4:59:58 pm UTC

Strong Fox (Des Plaines, Illinois US) Age: 28 - Email


In my heart I believe in the constitution one of the greatest documents ever written. The founding fathers displayed wisdom far beyond their era. As such, I find that the only political party that truly has the same respect for freedom and the constitution is the Libertarian party. I believe that voting and involvement for pagans is a great priority, and I shall vote, as I always have.

I know that pagans throughout this nation are fighting the good fight, and winning at it. With the courts and the constitution on our side we will continue to gain acceptance and freedom. The first amendment gains strength every day, but it will be an eternal battle to keep those who would persecute us from turning the tide.

I also know that other parts of the constitution that are loosing the battle and grow weaker every day. Most notably the second amendment. That is our last resort to safeguard all the others. When it falls so too shall all the others. For I know that if the tide should turn against us and a return to the burning times comes about, I still have one last means of defense.

In keeping with all that is going on. I will vote for the libertarian party whenever I am able, except for president. 8 years of Clintler and Gore have resulted in them managing to keep there thieving hands in my wallet and federal storm troopers killing, maiming and terrifying innocent people. So I wish I could vote for Browne, but I must vote for Bush. I know he will not safeguard the first amendment, we will have the courts to do that. I also know that he will work to help restore the second amendment back to its rightful place.

Sorry for the long rant


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