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Posted: Sep. 8, 2002
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Question of the Week: 59 - 9/11/2001
911 America: Talking Through The Terror...
Talking Through The Terror... And helping each other cope with the tragedies that struck at the very heart of the United States. The Witches Voice has opened up this forum in order that Pagans may express their thoughts on the terrorist attacks that took place in NYC and DC on September 11th. As the full realization of what happened and the toll numbers begin to come in, Americans have many challenges ahead.
What are your thoughts on these incidents? How are you feeling? Feel free to post any magickal workings or other support gatherings planned in your area.
WebNote 9/16/2001: Since we launched this on 911 this forum as become laced with powerful inspiration and critical information, feel free to use the search functions on your left to better define the info you are looking for. Search for your area, famous Pagans, key words etc. Also check Wren's Nest News for the latest news related to our community.
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| As Requested By My Dear Friend, Jenne, I Am Cross-posting A Reply... ||Sep 13th. at 1:04:12 am UTC|
|Mavelle (DFW area, Texas US) ||Age: 26 - Email |
As requested by my dear friend, Jenne, I am cross-posting a reply to a military friend in our online pagan forum. Mainly, I had trouble expressing myself about what occured, until I responded to our friend Glenn.
* * *
Excuse the Xianese, but Amen Sister. You so said it. And I want everyone here to see that, it's not our silence that will heal this...it is our expression and our words. By speaking out and getting our feelings out in the open, we can begin to understand the filth the outrage the utter despair that is churning in our collective minds.
You kicked ass in that little article you just wrote, Ma--and I wish you'd send it in to like witch's voice or something--it's eloquent and well-put. War is bad--war is not good. But it's a necessary tool. And as animals (and yes, I do believe we are animals), we have our own instincts and behaviors. Unfortunately, violence is one of them. But we are also divine enough to realize that the violence should be as well placed as possible...and I think it needs to be placed directly on the asses of the perps. Simple as that.
Brava, m'dear. You spoke like a born speech writer--perish the thought, I know.
More huggles (you sound like you need them--and I do, too! ;))
--- In astral-chat@y..., "Komadori" wrote:
> Glenn, my prayers go also to you and your new family and to my
> brother and his family, as well as all U.S. military families. When
> the president says "war" it is very different from a citizen
> saying "war" as you know. This is a very different war with different
> strategies, but we cannot exclude the possibility of our brothers and
> sisters in the military, will fight and die for the liberty we have
> often taken for granted.
> I hate war. But I know that so does everyone else on this list. I
> hate also the fact that other pagans have and will continue to lift
> their noses to our pagan brothers and sisters in the military. They
> do not understand.
> We are human. We are not perfect. We are a part of nature, and we are
> predators, not just gatherers. We can choose to be vegetarian, but we
> are not by birth. As omnivores, this is our natural heritage. With
> cogniscience comes the matured versions of our instinctual nature.
> War is brutal, but sometimes it is necessary in order to protect the
> values we hold so dear. I hate it, but this is how life is.
> Not on this list, but on another, someone didn't think we should go
> to war.
> I think we should. I like to think myself a pacifist. I don't see
> myself harming someone, much less killing them. Perish the thought!
> But I cannot say what I would do would my life or the lives of my
> loved-ones and innocents be endangered.
> Not only were lives of innocents endangered yesterday. They were not
> only taken, but STOLEN. The lives are gone forever, even if you
> believe in reincarnation: each incarnation is like a snowflake. Each
> moment of each life is unique. There are tens of thousands, I feel,
> of unique innocent lives that were taken, and countless families
> I lost my father to a massive heartattack without warning, back
> in '97. Little children, teenagers, and adults all lost their
> fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, ect ect ect: all to these
> suicidal thieves who have twisted a beautiful religion to their
> designs as excuses for the hatred they have grown up with and
> If we react with our instincts, we will be no better than them. If we
> react lilylivered and yellowbellied, we will disgrace the lives that
> were stolen and it WILL continue. It happened in '93, it happened
> again. There is a pattern. We simply must nip this hatred in the bud,
> and though I cannot stand the president personally, I agree with him
> on this issue.
> Throughout this ordeal, images of Waco kept coming to mind. The fact
> that someone can twist faith to such a level. It is frightening and
> sickening. I do not know, but I think that this cake cannot be
> unbaked, as far as the mental outset.
> I also am a bit more stable inside (I looked stable outside, but was
> shaken within, yesterday) today, as I go to work on the 16th floor of
> a highrise outside of downtown, working my job within a
> financial institution's office. Even still, when I look outside, I
> can visualize what it might have looked like, and it pains me to
> think how brutal the occurence of how these people died.
> I hope and pray that survivors will continue to be found within the
> rubble. I feel selfish for worrying that my brother will be sent
> should the warfare escalate to something more... traditional.
> It's funny. I couldn't find the words just an hour or so ago. I think
> the dam just blew. I'll leave it there, though, I guess. I still feel
> that nothing I can say really says it though. And on second thought
> of that, I think that's good. I really wouldn't want a word or
> expression to exist in language for what I feel. I don't want to feel
> this way again, nor for anyone else.
> Blessings and Love,
| I Have Been Praying And Crying And Asking The Lord And Lady... ||Sep 13th. at 1:04:35 am UTC|
|Northstar (Sacramento) ||Age: 44 |
I have been praying and crying and asking the Lord and Lady to send love and comfort. As I was meditating yesterday I tried to visualize a pinpoint of white light, God and Goddess energy, going to each of the victims and their families. I am newly exploring Wicca and Meditation, but I gave it all my heart.
If any of you has lost someone dear, I ask the Lord and Lady and your memories of that loved one to give you strength. Every tear that has been cried is for you personally.
Northstar in Sacramento
| When I Woke Up September 11th I Didn't Realize That From The... ||Sep 13th. at 1:08:34 am UTC|
|Christie (Chickasha, Oklahoma US) ||Age: 19 - Email |
When I woke up September 11th I didn't realize that from the moment the first of the World Trade Center Towers was hit my world would be unalterably changed. I can't imagine the sheer hatred and rage that would cause anyone to kill so many in cold blood. I don't want a war. I want justice. Justice is such a funny word because in some cases it's just a glorified word for revenge. I have never thought of myself as ever wanting to see anyone hurt. However, I think the OKC Bombing was the only other time I have ever wanted to see somebody pay for what has been done so much. When I woke up this morning I realized--I don't recognize the world any more because the world has gone crazy. In a world gone mad all we can rely on are our families, our friends, and our faith. I'm angry and scared and all I can ask is that true justice be served and that we all pray for peace. May the Great God and Great Goddess watch over us all...
| It Is Tough To Keep A Lightheart At Times Like These. As... ||Sep 13th. at 1:10:08 am UTC|
|Snow Owl (Charlotte, North Carolina US) ||Age: 24 - Email |
It is tough to keep a lightheart at times like these. As a Unitarian Pagan, I find myself torn between what is "right" and what is "wrong." To be honest, there is no no "right" or "wrong" anymore when it comes to feelings. The words have no meaning to me anymore when it comes to feelings. I feel deep within the people responsible, that means the Bin Laden, as well as his haborers, need to be dealt with in the most harsh way possible. I feel we need to let the world know that the United States of America will not stand for this, and neither will the countries who stand behind us. It literally makes me ill watching the pictures from Afghanistan with people dancing in rejoice for our despair. I have hardly been able to eat, sleep, or function like I normally do. For this point on out, my life, my views, my ways of thinking, and the way I conduct my life, will never be the same again. It feels so far, as if I am still inside a derranged Die Hard movie. It does not seem real yet, but I know logically it is. I am angry, I am confused, I am sad, I am hurt, and I am so tired of this bull crud! I do not feel any religion or spirituality out there is more right than the other. This is not a time of separation of the religions, this is a time of coming together and healing. I feel overall, good things will come out of this in the end of it (whenever that might be). I feel this will heal our religious and spiritual differences, and truly head us in the directions the Age of Aquairus has in store for us. Christians, Jews and many more, along side Pagans, are coming together in prayer and healing. This is heading us in the right direction now as a nation, and a people! But until we are all calmed down and begin this work after the mourning, I will sit back and try to make sense of all this, and force some food down my throat so I am able to stay alive.
May we all heal soon! May our anger transform into healing energy for the world and universe soon!
Blessings and Peace!
| I Sit Here In Anchorage Alaska And Know That The People Here... ||Sep 13th. at 1:21:44 am UTC|
|onekrystalynn (Anchorage, Alaska US) ||Age: 26 - Email |
I sit here in Anchorage Alaska and know that the people here who are so very far away from all that has happened both in distance and in time (being that we are an hour ahead of the apcific time zones, most of us literaly woke up to this news)send thoughts and prayers. With us being so very far away we can not readily send support as we found out what was going on airlines were grounded and it takes four hours to just fly to Seattle, otherwise I'm sure we would do more, i know many would want to.
In the past i know that alot of us are closet pagans; who hopefully will feel able to come forward as a community to possible DO something, if nothing else to help "shield" some of the oil products that we send to the states.
I sit and hear of the brave souls in the cities dealing with crumbling and collapsing buildings and my heart goes out to all of them. It hits alittle close to home as my father is a retired police offier and i know a few of the men in uniform here in town, i understand their fears that go so unspoken, and i understand their drive. I feel a little helpless not from the actions of the people who wish to cast fear and hate, but from the fact that I am unable to at least offer my strenght to help shift through the rubble.
I know that i am going to get together with a few of my "solitare" freinds to see if we can entice the closet society of pagans to group together and see if there is something we can DO to help if nothing else send hope, love and understanding to sites so very far away.
Go in peace, dear friends who have fallen and be embraced into the mother's arms and may she shelter you until it is your time to return.
| My 12-year-old Daughter Asked To Go To A (non-religious) Peace Rally... ||Sep 13th. at 1:25:55 am UTC|
|Runesdatter (Portland, Oregon US) ||Age: 32 - Email |
My 12-year-old daughter asked to go to a (non-religious) peace rally that her friend's parents are attending tonight, and I told her no. I explained that the people who committed this deadly violence *must* have justice done to them--and that justice is unlikely to be "peaceful"--or they will continue to kill innocent people with cowardly acts. Karma *will* happen, but earthly justice should be pursued as well.
The Muslim *extremists* (for I know the Islamic faith is not normally violent) who are suspected to be responsible for this atrocity already see the US as weak & godless; they have nothing but contempt for our lives and our varied faiths. NO peace rally is going to do right by the memory of the hundreds killed, the mothers & fathers & children (according to CNN, a 2-month-old baby was on one of those hijacked planes). I explained that these terrorists almost certainly acted against the US partly because of their religious beliefs, and that we can't condone religious intolerance that encourages anyone to kill in the name of God!
I have relatives (Pagan and non) in the US Armed Forces; I would worry about them if the US goes to war, but I will also be immensely proud of their patriotic service. If the US Congress declares war against a nation which has aided & abetted these terrorists, our family will support that action. So no, I won't allow my children to attend a "peace rally" where acts of justice are condemned because they might be violent.
My 9-year-old daughter asked me last night what we could do...I explained that I already had made an appointment to donate blood next week, and we could also light a candle together. So together we lit a candle dedicated to strength and love for the victims & their loved ones, and for justice to be done to the terrorists.
Freedom is a privelege, not a right. All the freedoms of this nation, including freedom of religion, have been paid for with the lives of our forefathers and mothers. Those who will not fight for their freedoms shouldn't complain when they lose them!
| After Reading Through A Number Of The Postings Here,i Am Beginning... ||Sep 13th. at 1:28:46 am UTC|
|GweFinn Cinnlass (Hokah, Minnesota US) ||Age: 41 - Email |
After reading through a number of the postings here, I am beginning to feel somewhat better.It is wonderful and inspiring to hear the voices of so many supporters, both near and far.I thank you all...
Today Rhiannon's head hangs low.She is weary from her task, but certain that many heros have reached their destiny.My heart goes out to the many rescue workers, both living and at rest..., having ridden in Rhiannon's arms.
* * * * * * *
I have to admit..., I am angry..., I am fearful..., and I am disgusted.
I am angry that my sense of freedom and security has been attacked.
I am fearful that it will not stop, no matter what response is taken.
I am disgusted that this kind of inhumanity can happen at all.
I try to stay informed of world events and the tides of world opinions.I read over Pravda.ru regularly, the BBC news, and The Afghan News Center has become a recent addition to my "bookmarks".I feel I have been aware of the hatred towards all things "American", for some time.And yet..., I had no fear.I put faith in the security services of our political machine, and did not fear.
Today I have a very different view, I have seen and can accept the frail balance of our freedom.I may still be angry, but that anger is now directed towards the machine that was supposed to keep our freedom secure.
As a nation, I know that a war is inevitable, a war against an unseen advisary.We will not be fighting against another nation, but against a concept of evil.That's right..., evil.We cannot attribute these acts of violence against us to any one group, or person.Evil resides in the hearts of man, and that is our enemy.
I hear a lot of anti-islamic voices, and more after these latest occurances.But to blame all of "them" is an absolute error.There have been many peaceful voices in their ranks.Voices that have preached tolerance, love for all humanity, and the end to violence.The irony of Yusaf Islam's(Cat Stevens) "Where do the Children Play?" was not lost on me today when I reminded myself of this fact.
Muhammad preached more than "Jihad", he also preached tolerance, but his words have been twisted by the fanatics that use them as means to their own ends.To fight for what you believe in is an admirable trait, and a lesson for us all.We must embrace this concept and hold it above us as we fight for the freedom of all mankind.
Wars are not waged for the living, or the dead, but for the future.Let us not act hastily out of anger towards the innocent.It is the slow and steady warrior that wins the war.He may suffer blows in the battle, but a faith-filled firm resolve is his aid towards the winning of the war.Unfortunately, our enemy already knows this.They too fight for a future and do not fear death to gain it.
There are two ways to vanquish an enemy;
1.Eliminate them through might.
2.Embrace them with right.
Let us pray that our choices are fair and just...
| The Day After--still A Day Of Shock And Heartbreak. Working At... ||Sep 13th. at 1:32:21 am UTC|
|Irishmouse (Shelton, Washington US) ||Age: 57 - Email |
The day after--still a day of shock and heartbreak. Working at a VA hospital it was hard to see the shock on patients faces. Anger is coming through now. I want to see the people responsible caught and destroyed. The sleeping tiger is awaking and woe to the enemies of our land. Yet, not undirected anger, but anger at those who think it is the heigth of heroism to kill thousands of innocent people, even people of their own nationality and religion. But not really of their religion because theirs is a perverted version of belief. May the gods strike them quickly as one would put a rabid animal to death because that is what they are, rabid and mad. No sane person would commit the atrocities they have committed.
My love and energy goes out to all the suffering victims of this attack. I can not comprehend the mind of someone who so callously kills. They must be stopped before they do it again. May this not be the start of another war but may the perpetrators all be caught and killed so they may not be able to cause such horror to come upon us again.
| I Just Turned 19 A Week And A Half Ago. I've Been... ||Sep 13th. at 1:45:11 am UTC|
|- Morgaine, Priestess of the Coven of the BlackRaven (Bellingham, Washington US) ||Age: 19 - Email |
I just turned 19 a week and a half ago. I've been practitioning for over a year. I know the Lord and Lady speak to us in many ways, but I was not prepared for Tusday.
Monday night I was restless, to say the least. I sat up and read, tried top go to bed. Finally I did fall asleep around 2am, PST. I woke up around 5am from a dead sleep. I wandered around the house for about a half hour, feeling rather distraught, welt to bed again, and then fell back asleep, and began dreaming.
I dreamed about an airplane.
I was woken up by my fiancee's mother at 8am PST. She said, "The WTC and Pentagon have been attacked by hijacked planes."
Why would I have a dream of a plane right before and during the time it happened? I don't know. Since Tusday I have been unable to sleep, and when I do close my eyes for any period of time beyond a few minutes, I see images of what happened from the view of victims. One moment I see it from the veiwpoint of an airplamne passenger, a woman with a child, seeing a blond stewardess being stabbed, then I see it from the view of a man working in his office in the WTC as he looks out his office window and sees the plane coming....then blackness.
Do any of you others out there see these things? I do not know what to do, and I find myself more and more distraught.
| Merry Meet Everyone Of The World, (or At Least As Merry As... ||Sep 13th. at 1:47:07 am UTC|
|Laneth the Wanderer / James Simon (Colac, Victoria AU) ||Age: 18 - Email |
Merry Meet Everyone of the World, (Or at least as merry as possible...)
What a travesty! My whole community is totally dumbfounded and is living life like drones because they are stupified by the extremity of the violence that has taken place in your lovely country of America.
I feel for every person who is grieving and that is the whole world, and I wish that there was something that myself and my coven members could do for ye.
I am currently channeling the power of colac from the Botanical Gardens through my body and sending it to the needy in America. I know that it is reckless and dangerous but any risk is acceptable for such need.
I don't feel that anyone should condone such acts of terrorism, I certainly don't. As a Druidic Sorcerer, I am calling on the help of other the other sorcerers of the world to assist me in aiding the Special Sevices to find the perpetrators.
As Pagans, I know that killing is out of our beliefs and that we feel that a;ll life is embraced, but at the moment, the non-Pagan community doesn't share our beliefs and they need our love and support.
I have recently set up the biggest Ward working that I have ever constructed in my 10 year history of being involved in the Craft. I need to know from others around the world what I can do to assist the peoples who are working magick.
I can be contacted at the following (ringing, though expensive, will reach me quicker and before tomorrow midday in Australia...)
firstname.lastname@example.org / email@example.com
61 3 52 31 22 00 (03 5231 2200) / +61 407 095 725 (0407-095-725)
Please let me assist in your magickal workings. I can spread my awareness very far indeed.
A Message To The Families / Friends Of The Victims.
I would like to take this opportunity to state that if in any way I can help,
I will. I know that ye are all very upset and will probably say that and Aussie 18 yr old cant do anything for us, but just know that I am more than I seem.
Self proclamaition I dont take part in, I only state the truth.
I have retained all my knowledge from my past lives and I can help share with ye. Chances are, I have probably met some of ye before.
Please Take Me seriously and I will act as though ye are my family.
Blessed Be all thee who seek the Love and Guidance of Aradia and Pan.
Blessed Be and loved are Ye!
Laneth the Wanderer
Keybearer to the Sacred Coven of the Southern Oracle.
| On Behalf Of My Mother, Melanie, And Her Family:we Are Shocked... ||Sep 13th. at 1:56:56 am UTC|
|Melanie Anne Whelan (Carpendeit, Victoria AU) ||Age: 41 - Email |
On behalf of my Mother, Melanie, and her family:
We are shocked to the core and crying in our hearts for your losses.
We are thinking of ye and have lit candles for your bereaved...
Although we are Christian, we are against this kind of warfare and we feel that everyone should be entitled the love of the world.
Our thoughts, loves and hopes soar on the wings of the Phoenix of Life for ye!
| I Have Always Embraced The Ideals Of The Goddess That All Like... ||Sep 13th. at 2:03:22 am UTC|
|Patrick (Ft. Wayne, Indiana US) ||Age: 25 - Email |
I have always embraced the ideals of the goddess that all like is sacred and that even the loss of one diminishes us. However, my feelings right now are very conflicted. I must admit that when we find out who has done this to us that their entire country be reduced to a crater.
I have refraned from any kind of spell casting or wish craft as right now I dont think my focus is pure.
Sorry, I know I should be dealing with it better but I just can't seem to do it.
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