The opinions posted on the Pagan Perspective pages are those of individuals and are not neccessarily shared or endorsed by the Witches' Voice inc.
Posted: Sep. 8, 2002
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Church and State, Religion in School... What is YOUR View?
Church and State, Religion in School... What is YOUR View?
| Reponses: There are 122 responses posted to this question.
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| Although Not A Christian Myself, I Can Sympathize With Those Who Want... ||Aug 23rd. at 12:56:03 pm UTC|
|Richard Gant (Northern Kentucky University, Kentucky US) ||Age: 27 - Email |
Although not a Christian myself, I can sympathize with those who want to put the Ten Commandments (or some other religious teaching) in schools. By and large, this is an honest attempt (by most) to help instil morality in students. However, I think that they are misguided.
Putting the Ten Commandments, the Golden Rule, the Wiccan Rede, or any other set of religious (or secular) moral teachings on a wall or on book covers is not going to fix things. If the youth of today are less moral than those of the past (a view I remain skeptical of), slogans are not going to help. Youth will not learn from slogans if they are not taught by example. Rather than try to force religion of any stripe down the throats of school children, the individuals who want religion in schools would be better served by living their religion and setting a good example for others.
Religion does not belong in school. It is a personal matter, and it belongs at home and at places of worship.
| This Is A Very Easy Question Made Complicated By Personal Feelings Of... ||Aug 23rd. at 1:16:13 pm UTC|
|Shadow (St. Augustine, Florida US) ||Age: 35 - Email |
This is a very easy question made complicated by personal feelings of who's religion is right.
In america, we have the fundamental right to practice what ever religion we want. This said, The govenrment shall pass no law respecting one religion over another, with this said the solution is quite simple. If you allow one, just one you have to allow ALL!
Symbols of personal religion so long as they do not detract from the learning process, ie. T-Shirts with slogans that Jesus was a freak, are up to the individule. A pentagram, isa symbol, like the crucifix. A T-shirt that denounces or makes fun of someone elses religion is detracting from the other and the learning process.
The ten comandments are guidlines/rules for one religion to follow but not all religions. Personally, the first three to me are nothing more than a way to control personal thought.
The fourth one can be appplied to many religions.
The fifth one is debatable, some mothers and fathers do not deseerve to be honored. Should we honor an abusive parent? How about the one that split because times got hard. No, the fifth one is very debatable.
The sixth one is a very standard sociological fact of living in a civilized world.
The seventh, well define adultry. Too many definitions to suit my needs and the needs of many. If you were married once but now are divorced and decide to carry on a loving relationship with another person who was never married adultry? Some factions would say yes.
eighth and ninth are again, rules that civilized countries need to keep the perspective of safty and security.
tenth is another debatable one but not nearly as the fifth.
covet as defined by Websters ninth new collegiate dictionary (yes I know it's old), 1. to wish for enviously. 2. to desire (what belongs to another) inordinately or culpably 3. to feel inordinate desire for what belongs to another.
Inordinate same dictionary, Disorderly, unregulated. exceeding reasonable limits. Immoderate.
This definition of covet could be very dangerous to a married woman, but.. if you notice, it does not say, coven your neighbors husband. It specifically says wife.
This is too limiting and sexist. It also gives the sense of women being objects of sexualilty, while sometimes in appropriate places with the appropriate choosen person is appropriate for a woman, it is not in most cases. It degrades women from the sense of being, property. Much like the adultry being ok for a male to engage in sex with 30 wives, but a woman has to stay with the male and not waiver an iota.
So, what it boils down to are
Eight, nine and six. These are not ten commandments but three (hey look one of them "witch" numbers bad joke but you get my point) very sound laws.
Stealing is never right, killing can sometimes bve justified with self defence, so now we are down to 2 commandments with restrictions on one of them.
My point is that what works for one religion may not work for another, and since our govenrment can pass no law respecting one religion over another, it can allow religion into the schools should the people decide appropriate but, it CANNOT discriminate!
All or none.
| I Think That Church And State Should Be Completely Separated When It... ||Aug 23rd. at 2:17:03 pm UTC|
|AzureMyst Jade (East Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania US) ||Age: 19 |
I think that church and state should be completely separated when it comes to schools. If kids want to pray in school, and their parents want that too, they should go to a parochial school. I'm a college student, and pagan. When I have kids, they will be going to public school. My dream is to open a pagan parochial school. But that's a long way off, seeing as how i need to finish school and get my masters in ed.
| Religion And Politics In My Humble Opinion, Should Always Remain Seperate! No... ||Aug 23rd. at 3:12:30 pm UTC|
|Ravenwing (Lethbridge, Alberta CA) ||Age: 21 |
Religion and politics in my humble opinion, should ALWAYS remain seperate!
no one wants someone elses beliefs forced upon them. If they must have religion in schools shouldn't they take into consideration that, christianity( i'm assuming this is the only group lobbying for prayer in school, with the mention of the ten commandments and all) is NOT the only belief system out there! Kids should be able to decide for themselves what spiritual path is best suited for them.
I'm from Canada and i'm pretty sure religion is ony a big deal in private/catholic schools, but i can only speak for my town, i'm not sure how it works in th rest of the country:)
| In My Opinion I Think That Bring Religion Back Into Schools Is... ||Aug 23rd. at 6:44:36 pm UTC|
|palemoonmistres (waldorf, Maryland US) ||Age: 21 - Email |
In my opinion i think that bring religion back into schools is a bad idea. People dont want to accept what other people believe and then that leads to hate crimes. I think the only time when religion can be bought back to schools, is when human nature changes to accept all things. It is in human nature not to accept things that are different.
And then u have to look at what religion they bring into schools. I went to a private catholic school, and they force believing it on you. That kind of turned me away from religion. Kids don't what to be forced into believing something. Kids have a choice on their own.
Kids have minds and can think for their own. Let them choice what they want to believe in. Schools should not state what the kids should believe. It is, in my opinion, only another way to have control.
To me if we let schools bring in religion and they do not tolorate all religions, the we are giving them on more thing. Schools already try to state how kids should think and wear and basically is taking a child's individuality away. When I was in school, i hated it. And know i am free, to think on my own and make my own desicions.
If schools bring back religion, then they are taking away the individuality of a person.
| Merry Meet ! I Do Not Agree With Religion In School Religion Starts... ||Aug 23rd. at 6:59:09 pm UTC|
|Lady Scarlett (Houma, Louisiana US) ||Age: 25 - Email |
Merry Meet !
I do not agree with religion in school religion starts in the home. If they post the Ten Commandments then they will have to let me post the Tent of the Craft. If not I will fight for my rights. If I can't win I will pull my kids out of school and teach them my self.
In Love and Light
| This Is Such A Complicated Topic, I Almost Hesitate To Respond. But... ||Aug 23rd. at 8:38:36 pm UTC|
|ShaylaB (Phoenix, Arizona US) ||Age: 34 - Email |
This is such a complicated topic, I almost hesitate to respond. But since I'm categorically incapable of not putting my two cents in, I'm going to take the plunge.
I feel the biggest problem in this argument is not whether religion belongs in school, but a general lack of respect on both sides of the issue. A lack of respect on the part of the Religious Right for those who wish to practice diverse religions or no religion at all, that is true. But also a lack of respect on the part of those who wish to ban all religion from government and school. As if you could separate the aspects of your life so neatly?
The fact is, those who are truly spiritual will practice their faith whereever they go and in whatever they do. They cannot help it. But to institutionalize a certain spiritual philosophy and back that up with government funding...uh, no.
There's a big difference, however, between tolerating religion and endorsing it. A school allowing young religious groups to meet privately on its campus is very different from a school allowing groups to actively recruit or hold public prayer meetings.
Religious tolerance in my book has to extend to *all* religions. In other words, a Pagan trashing all Christians as being closed minded and inflexible is just as wrong as a Christian trashing all Pagans for being Satanists and animal abusers. Tolerance = Respect, and it should go both ways.
| In My Humble Opinion, I Would Regard The Ten Commandments As The... ||Aug 23rd. at 9:13:45 pm UTC|
|Dolphinwitch (London, England UK) ||Age: 31 - Email |
In my humble opinion, I would regard the Ten Commandments as the Christian moral code - though if I remember correctly they were not the original commandments, as when Moses saw what his people were doing when he first came down the mountain he smashed the tablets of emerald and went back up for a while before coming back with the tablets of stone. Kind of makes you wonder what was on the orignal ones, doesn't it? Anyhow, that's way off topic. Here, in the UK, I know of a primary school where there are Buddhists, Seventh Day Adventists, Plymouth Brethren and Pagans, along with the usual Christian children. At assembly some of the children have to leave at a certain point because their beliefs do not allow them to be told some things, which is slightly concerning, BUT the school allow them to do this without question as that is how their religion works. The headmistress of this school, when asked about Paganism and whether she or the school governors would have any difficulties coping with Pagan children, responded that there were no problems as far as she was concerned, expressed interest in Paganism and how it worked and asked if the children concerned might require any days away from school for religious reasons. if only ALL educators could take such an enlightened view.
| We Live In A Small Town,the School That My Children Attend... ||Aug 23rd. at 11:05:10 pm UTC|
|Bo'Wind Art Do'bhran (Nappanee, Indiana US) ||Age: 36 - Email |
We live in a small town, the school that my children attend have a bible study, of course being an open minded person that Iam, I let my children go to a christian bible class, I had to let them learn for themselves what path they wanted, the questions my son asked me after the first weeks of the class were scary, The teacher told my son that "he would go to hell if he did not behave" , it took me a while to calm down. My son and daughter were scared they then asked me what I thought about what the teacher said, well, I explained to them what mommy believes and told a few stories, and my son said "Wow, that sounds nice and easier to believe!
I wouldnt mind if there is religion in the schools if and only if they allowed all religions. Maybe, someone should start the first Pagan Elementary School.
My kids would be the first to enroll.
| I Pulled My Son Out Of Public School To Teach Him At... ||Aug 24th. at 12:38:50 am UTC|
|Jess (Wichita, Kansas US) ||Age: 26 - Email |
I pulled my son out of public school to teach him at home for many reasons. Being easier was definately not one of them but religion was among them. We live in a relatively small city and so we are still somewhat in the closet. I don't like having Jesus shoved in my face but as an adult I can walk away. My 9 year old son however would be suspended for walking away because it would be against their "standard conduct". I would like to believe in seperation of church and state (schools) but I don't think I'll see it in my lifetime. If a church oriented school was what I had wanted then I would have sent him to a private school! Besides, I would think it was disrespectful to any other religion to do such a thing. If you're going to teach one then teach them all!
| Well I Feel If This Is A Public School Than Why Not... ||Aug 24th. at 1:40:07 am UTC|
|Chris Rowe (Portsmouth, Virginia US) ||Age: 14 - Email |
Well I feel if this is a public school than why not have our public beliefs. I mean if we can't do this than how can we be ourselves. The whole youth follows something and/or someone. The school would like each indivisual to show positive attitudes well how can u if your forced not to be your self. The school is free to express it's (School Spirit), but the student/students can't express there self, there spirit, I think that is a bunch of crock. I feel one should be able to speak and act freely in a PUBLIC school. Religion in school isn't a big crisis I mean when the luch bell rings...HELLOOOO.. that's out time not theres.
I feel religion in school should be allowed.
| Merry Meet All, Does Any One Here Believe That The Goverment Should... ||Aug 24th. at 2:50:27 am UTC|
|Alex Brave (Elko, Nevada US) ||Age: 18 - Email |
Merry meet all,
Does any one here believe that the goverment should control religion? Does any one here believe that pentacles should be baned from school? If we can't look at this from the prospective of those who DO how can we change this situation?
Not every one who wanders is lost, Alantis
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