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Posted: Sep. 8, 2002
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Question of the Week: 59 - 9/11/2001
911 America: Talking Through The Terror...
Talking Through The Terror... And helping each other cope with the tragedies that struck at the very heart of the United States. The Witches Voice has opened up this forum in order that Pagans may express their thoughts on the terrorist attacks that took place in NYC and DC on September 11th. As the full realization of what happened and the toll numbers begin to come in, Americans have many challenges ahead.
What are your thoughts on these incidents? How are you feeling? Feel free to post any magickal workings or other support gatherings planned in your area.
WebNote 9/16/2001: Since we launched this on 911 this forum as become laced with powerful inspiration and critical information, feel free to use the search functions on your left to better define the info you are looking for. Search for your area, famous Pagans, key words etc. Also check Wren's Nest News for the latest news related to our community.
| Reponses: There are 969 responses posted to this question.
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| I Don't Really Know Where To Begin, Other Than I Will Never... ||Sep 14th. at 10:31:45 am UTC|
|Anaya (Surrey (near London), England UK) ||Age: 23 |
I don't really know where to begin, other than I will never be able to erase the memories of this week from my mind.
Everyone I have spoken to has said that it's almost like a Hollywood movie, which if they had seen at the cinema they would never have believed. Still there is shock to know that it is real life and thousands of innocent people have died.
Here in England we are deeply affected, I personally have cried for the victims and their families. Each day that passes reveals another families trauma, another miraculous near miss of a survivor, another insight into the horror, yet little survivors being pulled alive from under the rubble. Another name and picture of a loved one that didn't make it.
I dream that we do not live in a world that has people capable of this evil, but my dreams are shattered by the single, most horrific, deliberate attack on innocence that I have ever seen in my lifetime.
My heart goes out to you all in the US and I pray for your safety. I pray that this evil can be caught before more damage is done.
Keep safe, we are all thinking of you,
With deepest sympathies,
| In The Midst Of All This Terror And Tragedy, When We Should... ||Sep 14th. at 10:48:57 am UTC|
|Erin Schroeder (Tyler, Texas US) ||Age: 33 - Email |
In the midst of all this terror and tragedy, when we should all be working together rather than pointing fingers and placing blame, it never ceases to amaze me that there are still some people in this country who refuse to do so. I was watching (again) the coverage on CNN (I'm sure most if not all of us are) and in the scrolling type across the bottom of the screen, I was horrified to read the latest "brilliant" statement from Jerry Falwell (I refuse to put the Rev. in front of his name after this). To paraphrase, "JF believes the Pagans, Abortionists, Feminists, Gays and Lesbians to be the cause of these terrorist attacks." Is JF really an Arab Terrorist, and we've never known? These sentiments seem to fit in completely with some of their beliefs. If he wants to look at it from a religious view point, he should realize that these attackers hate Christianity (obviously so does JF; apparently he doesn't practice what he preaches!), and have made no bones about letting us know that. Bin Laden even attempted to assassinate the Pope a few years ago. I think it is so asinine that JF would even DARE to suggest that the terrorists care about whether we are Pagans, abortionists, feminists, gays and lesbians. In this time of trouble, he should be offering support to the families of the victims, the courageous rescuers and to this country, as we prepare for the proper course of action against these heinous crimes. He should NOT be using this tragedy as a pulpit from which to preach his personal (and VERY un-Christian) beliefs.
| I Think It Should Be Posted That The 700 Club Is Blaming... ||Sep 14th. at 10:52:09 am UTC|
|Aradia (Newport, Rhode Island US) ||Age: 21 - Email |
I think it should be posted that the 700 Club is blaming the non christians for angering God and bringing this war and tragedy upon the united states. a friend sent this link to me, and i encourage you to read. i do not encourage flaming, but i do think that pagans, the gay community and non christians should know what is being said on national television and be prepared to answer the questions of followers of the Christian Broascast Network, should they see a Pentacle around your neck.
it keeps getting more and more tangled as the hours pass.
Blessings of Hope and Healing,
House of Annwyn
Providence/Newport Rhode Island
| Erin, Read The Article Just Posted...you'll Find It Intersting I Am... ||Sep 14th. at 10:54:12 am UTC|
|Aradia (Newport, Rhode Island US) ||Age: 21 |
Read the article just posted...you'll find it intersting i am sure.
| This Is A Rather Old Article As My Sinclair Has Been Dead... ||Sep 14th. at 10:58:56 am UTC|
|Bob Tengal (Toronoto, Ontario CA) ||Age: 47 |
This is a rather old article as My Sinclair has been dead for many years. But this has been circulating around Canadian sites for the past few days and I think it needs to continue to circulate.
America: The Good Neighbor.
Widespread but only partial news coverage was given recently to a remarkable editorial broadcast from Toronto by Gordon Sinclair, a Canadian television commentator. What follows is the full text of his trenchant remarks as printed in the Congressional Record: "This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth.
Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.
When France was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.
When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries in to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by tornadoes. Nobody helped.
The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars! into discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent, warmongering Americans.
I'd like to see just one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplane. Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas DC10? If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the International lines except Russia fly American Planes?
Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on the moon? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy, and you get automobiles.
You talk about American technocracy, and you find men on the moon -! not once, but several times - and safely home again.
You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everybody to look at. Even their draft dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at home to spend here.
When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both are still broke.
I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake.
Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them get kicked around. They will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of
Stand proud, America!
| It's Amazing That The Other So Called Main Stream Religions (christians, Jews... ||Sep 14th. at 11:01:12 am UTC|
|Red Raven (Baltimore, Maryland US) ||Age: 50 |
It's Amazing that the other so called main stream religions (Christians, Jews, Mosulums, and Hindu) have killed and mamed peoples in the name of their God over the last 4 thousands years. The same religions that look down on our Pagan/Wiccan beliefs. I alwways ask of them, when was the last time that Pagans/Wiccans started a war or killed in the name of the God/Godess.
| Don't Judge Our Leaders To Harshly - The Only Way To End Terrorism... ||Sep 14th. at 11:01:53 am UTC|
|Amy - wife and mom of 2 (Idaho Falls, Idaho US) ||Age: 22 - Email |
Don't judge our leaders to harshly - the only way to end terrorism is to kill it, and unfortunately, innocent people will die....those that can't help it that their counrty chooses to harbor terrorists. Its horrible, but the only way to get rid of terrorism is to get rid of the terrorist. Peace on earth won't happen until a bloody long war is fought and many innocent people die.
REMEMBER - to those of you who believe in reincarnation, that death isn't final and our loved ones aren't condemed to an eternity of immortality...(and yes I have lost loved ones before)
As a pagan community we HAVE TO focus on praying that the war is short and effective, we have to support it, because we, as Americans need to stand by our leaders (since we can't change their minds). Some of you might not agree with this, think I'm nuts, but these people have to be stopped and taking a passive view on the matter, one of no violence, won't help.
I have family in the military, and I'm scared to death that they will get called to war...but I know, as does my whole family and most of the world that if we don't take action, that sets the stage. That tells the terrorists that we will sit back and let our own people die.
War is needed in the situation. The president (and no I didn't vote for Bush) did not take his desicion to declare war lightly...he spoke with his advisors and military personnel and arrived that war is the only option to keep the world safe in the end.
Death in a bi-product of life
Some of us will die wishing there was a better way and some of us will die making a better way - but in the end it will be better...and we'll still all be dead
I do not wish to see any replies to this, I'm sure it offended a few people, so please if you must email me...don't congest this message baord with Flames to my post.
| I Thought The Speech That President Bush Made Was A Bit Ironic... ||Sep 14th. at 11:14:57 am UTC|
|Fae (San Diego, California US) ||Age: 15 - Email |
I thought the speech that President Bush made was a bit ironic. I just sat there in front of the TV and thought about how well it would go if that speech were twisted to be directed towards the subject of the Burning Times and the Inquisition and all that. My mind did it all, and it goes perfectly well, I admit. Just a random thought...
| I Have Just Spent The Last 3 Days Trying To Understand. My... ||Sep 14th. at 11:33:15 am UTC|
|Lee (las vegas, Nevada US) ||Age: 32 |
i have just spent the last 3 days trying to understand. my mind is having a very difficult time wrapping itself around this horror. i started to study the Craft only 6 months ago. i was raised catholic and could not, would not accept a vengeful god; today i fight my beliefs that i still can/will not accept that type of god. however i find myself wanting to punish those that did this. i have looked at the empty blue sky and a quite night sky trying to release this anger, this almost overwhelming desire to smash, throw, crush and destroy something, anything. so i will light my candles, say my prayers, wash my soul and body each and everytime i feel like i am loosing this battle to be peaceful and loving. please all of you send me your energy and love to win this battle for my soul, but before you wish for mine....join me in sending mine to those who have lost so much in these horrible days. blessed be.
| Dear Ones, Today You Morn For The Family Members Who Havemade... ||Sep 14th. at 11:55:09 am UTC|
|Mary (New York, New York US) ||Age: 40 |
Dear ones, today you morn for the family members who have made their transitions and who are still in the process. For many of you, the question is this: "why didn't we know?" or "shouldn't Spirit have told us of these things?"
We want you to all know that the words we gave you some time ago are now here: "There is no Human or Spirit who can tell you what is going to happen tomorrow, " we said. This is part of the new dimensionality...that all happens outside a linear time frame, and that Humanity is totally in charge.
What you saw today is the result of what we saw and reported to you as the potentials for 2000 and beyond. We told you that you would see spiritual rage, and that there would be forces who would not let go of the old paradigm - the way the world "used to work." Now you, in your country of America are also involved in actually feeling what this means. The battle begins in earnest, and now you know why you are called "warriors" of the light.
With the millennium change came new responsibility. Part of that revolves around this question: What will you do now? Can you lift yourselves above the anger? Can you see anything more in this than rage? Are you going to join or separate? The chasm opens and the choices become harder...such is the beginning of new wisdom for the planet.
The family who transited in this event, on this eleven day, agreed to be part of this Human horror potential... something that could have changed yesterday if Humanity had so decided. You agreed to go forward, however, and the result will make you part of the world family more than ever before. Perhaps this will bring you all closer to agreement? Perhaps this will eventually make you decide world events differently? Perhaps more will go to their knees? Perhaps more will understand the "world family?"
If so, then the Humans who came home today will have a grander party than they expected, for it will have advanced planetary healing. All is in divine order, and all is appropriate, even though such statements are not understandable while you are in sorrow. Can you find peace within your heart now, even for those who perpetrated the events? Can you think interdimensionally? These are the spiritual questions which will separate those who talk about spiritual growth, from those who actually understand and practice it.
Blessed are those family who remain, for they are feeling the pain and suffering of incredible loss. For now, send your energy and your love to them. Remember: The thoughts of the few can change the reality of the many. Hug them from afar. Bring them into your rooms and weep for them, for they need your help.
Then, when enough time has passed.... bring about wise decisions from a new resource of Humans who can now tap into the masters, the ones who are bringing their energy potential to the planet.
A call to action has been sounded in a land that was happy to just exist and watch the others work it out. Now you are all involved in the same challenges. The result? Human free choice will decide all, just as it always has. Only now, there is a profound urgency that was not there before.
You are not alone in this, and legions stand with you to bring about solution to what you all know is now very real.... the old vs. the new.
Love is infinitely more powerful, dear ones. Use it today!
We are with you in your sorrow, and the potential profound wisdom that can arise from it.
You are dearly loved!
| I Am Posting This For Any Feedback On How We As Witches... ||Sep 14th. at 11:55:56 am UTC|
|Zyyto (New Haven, Connecticut US) ||Age: 34 - Email |
I am posting this for any feedback on how we as Witches can respond to this. Witchcraft is about doing. Well, our Goddess/God has given us the power to work magick. So let's work magick. Mabon swiftly approaches. A time between time, a short duration of energy in balance to be drawn upon and weilded if need be. Well, I think the need BE! Our ancestors would be using their wise ways to cause change. All Witches everywhere, do somethimg this Mabon. In a coven or solitary, whatever your tradition, raise enery, make a poppet, make a talisman, chant a spell....whatever you can do so that the perpetrators be bound and powerless, any others who are affiliated be found out and dealt with justly, swiftly and effortlessly, with harm to no innocents. We know what makes the universe run. We understand energy and how it connects everything in ALL the worlds. If you have ever done the simplest spell, you know a little power can go a long way. Imagine what all of us can do. Just a suggestion, wold love other ideas. I will be directing my energy next Saturday toward the binding and mobilization of any involved in these horrific acts. I hope others will join.
| From Another Message Board:an Open Letter To A Terrorist: (author Unknown... ||Sep 14th. at 11:57:15 am UTC|
|Suzanne (Bradford, Pennsylvania US) ||Age: 21 |
From another message board:
An open letter to a terrorist:
Well, you hit the World Trade Center, but you missed America. You hit the Pentagon, but you missed America. You used helpless American bodies, to take out other American bodies, but like a poor marksman, you STILL missed America.
Why? Because of something you guys will never understand. America isn't about a building or two, not about financial centers, not about military centers, America isn't about a place, America isn't even about a bunch of bodies.
America is about an IDEA. An idea, that you can go someplace where you can earn as much as you can figure out how to, live for the most part, like you envisioned living, and pursue Happiness. (No guarantees that you'll reach it, but you can sure try!)
Go ahead and whine your terrorist whine, and chant your terrorist litany: "If you can not see my point, then feel my pain." This concept is alien to Americans. We live in a country where we don't have to see your point. But you're free to have one. We don't have to listen to your speech. But you're free to say one. Don't know where you got the strange idea that everyone has to agree with you.
There's a spirit that tends to take over people who come to this country, looking for opportunity, looking for liberty, looking for freedom. Even if they misuse it.
You guys seem to be incapable of understanding that we don't live in America, America lives in US! American Spirit is what it's called. And killing a few thousand of us, or a few million of us, won't change it. Most of the time, it's a pretty happy-go-lucky kind of Spirit. Until we're crossed in a cowardly manner, then it becomes an entirely different kind of Spirit.
Wait until you see what we do with that Spirit, this time.
Sleep tight, if you can. We're coming.
I know this seems to advocate violence against the persons responsible, and even the countries they reside in. But I agree with Amy from Idaho. Terrorism needs to be stopped in whatever way is needed to make sure this doesn't happen again. Because terrorism is the new warfare. The Gulf War proved that to try and take the American Armed Forces on in a warhead-to-warhead battle is futile. Terrorism is the way to strike at us now. This has been escalating since before Oklahoma City. And if we do not wipe out this threat, it will continue to plague us.
Tonight I am participating in a candlelight vigil at 7:00. I don't care if we're christians or pagans, we're still all Americans.
Love and Blessed Be,
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