The opinions posted on the Pagan Perspective pages are those of individuals and are not neccessarily shared or endorsed by the Witches' Voice inc.
Posted: Sep. 8, 2002
||This Page Viewed: 10,138,496
Vox Q Stats|
Times Viewed: 32,767
Lurker/Post Ratio: 337 to 1
Question of the Week: 81 - 10/13/2002
ExCUSE Me! Has Common Courtesy Become A Thing of the Past?
Is it just me or are people crabbier, ruder and less courteous than once was the norm? Have you ever received an email without any sort of greeting or salutation, but which ‘demands’ that you must do such-and-such for him/her and right now as well? Or perhaps had a parking spot stolen? Been given the one-finger salute? Been behind the person in the ten-items only line who has at least twice that amount? (C’mon! I know that you count them, too!) Held the door open for someone who obviously thinks that it must be your job or something and so has no need to thank you for YOUR courteous gesture? Tell us your horror stories! What can we do to make the world just a little better mannered?
For some background info, talking points and helpful suggestions, see: Courtesy by Chuck Gallozzi.
| Reponses: There are 97 responses posted to this question.
|| Reverse Sort
| Courtesy ||Oct 17th. at 9:27:24 pm UTC|
|Anna (Wisconsin) ||Age: 54 - Email |
Good manners are not dead, unlearned by many perhaps, but not dead. I find that when I treat others with respect and curtesy those manners are almost always returned. Maybe we can teach by example.
| Courtesy ||Oct 17th. at 10:01:20 pm UTC|
|Tracie (Charlotte, NC) ||Age: 28 - Email |
Well, there certainly has been a lot to say on this topic. Why, I wonder, do pagans have such a hard time being polite? I didn't see that specific post, but I will have to. I know that from recent experience in my coven (I just joined one), while a time to start is mentioned in email posts, once we gather, some members have other commitments that make it hard on them to get to our gatherings, and also, you can't account for traffic at any time of the day or night around here :)
I've been studying Paganism for nearly 10 years, but its the way my parents brought me up that affects my courteousness towards others, and I don't think that has much bearing on the fact that they are Christian.
Here's a theory: Some Pagans may think that being courteous might somehow reveal their beliefs and might then somehow leave them open for attack of prejudice. But again, this is just a thought. I know that when I show courtesy, no neon sign blinks over my head declaring my religion.
As for small town inhabitants staring at you when you drive in, remember that you are the newest thing, and you are also a stranger. Small towns pride themselves on being insular. My sister lives in one and she says a friend of hers who also lives there (10 years or more) is still considered an outsider, and hardly anyone is overly friendly. Actually heard much the same thing quoted on a "Murder, She Wrote" episode some years back by the main character.
Good luck everyone and remember, be nice! (even if it hurts)
| Common???????? ||Oct 17th. at 10:05:50 pm UTC|
|Don (Charleston, SC) ||Age: 29 - Email |
Common courtesy seems to have followed the same path as common sense.
If someone holds a door open for me, lets me into traffic, ect. I may not give a verbal indicator of what is done, but I at least nod or wave as the situation permits. As far as the ambulances go, I try to get out of the way of any emergency vehicle, they may one day be going to save me, so I wish others the same opportunity.
Until the majority sees the value of courtesy, the minority must do what they feel is right.
| A Couple Of Things I Haven't Seen Mentioned Here: ||Oct 17th. at 10:54:14 pm UTC|
|Legend (Chandler AZ) ||Age: 28 - Email |
There is a difference between being impolite and being direct. While it's always more polite to be polite (rather by definition), sometimes somebody's situation demands that they convey a given amount of information in the shortest time-span possible Of course, that's not an excuse to ALWAYS be in such a hurry that you can't be polite to people-- if that's the case, your life is just too damn complicated. On the other hand, if someone seems really upset, worried, concerned, in pain, of if you're working together on some project with a very finite time element (like finishing concrete before it sets up, say) it's actually less polite to expect people to be polite. Has anyone else ever gone up to the customer service counter of a store and been forced to stand there five minutes listening to the representative carrying on a mundane personal phone conversation? There is such a thing as TOO MUCH politeness.
Another example of excessive politeness I've come across, is in dealing with salespeople, telephone operators, managers, and bureaucracies in any form, where people seem to mistake kindess for weakness, and twist it to their advantage to get what they want out of you, and almost universally DISGUISEd as politeness. When all the time, you know what you want or need and have all the logic and reason your side and STILL practicallyhave to shove a gun in the person's face to get them to listen to you/take you seriously/give you what's rightfully yours/whatever. The problem is, politeness just isn't worth anything at the bank.
| What Is This "Curtesy" You Speak Of? ||Oct 17th. at 11:05:18 pm UTC|
|Jesica (CT) ||Age: 18 - Email |
Curtesy? For what? Before I get pegged as a disrespectful youth, may it be known that I treat all with the respect I wish I recieved. I'm labeled as a punk, yelled at, and harrased on a daily basis, by people of all ages. This wears me down. Keeping cheery and good natured is not an easy thing when you get put down far more often the smiled too. So why then, should this curtesy still exist?
| Great Question ||Oct 18th. at 2:55:04 am UTC|
|Perrin (Hades, still) ||Age: 26 - Email |
I think courtesy in general has taken a descent in recent years, for various reasons that no one really noticed. I think I "woke up" to this fact when a total stranger shot, and killed a man in Boulder, for no other reason than "Road Rage". Part of the blame for this the good old atomic bomb, prior to that invention you could kill, usually in an army or even a "police" action, but now one push of a button can wipe out the masses in a few seconds. We all have to find a release somehow, or some one pushes the wrong button, and we all get to find out if we're wrong. I try to be courteous to others, but some times it goes the wrong way. If you have a problem with being courteous, consider that their life is likely a lot worse than yours. The other person may have found out that his "Fiannce" is really a guy hiding from various parties for conning them. My point is that the Gods/Goddesses may rule the heavens, and hells, but only we can attempt to improve the world, just because I use blood sacrifices does not mean I'm a bad guy, just paranoid.
PS. I added the dots to my "mark" as the spaces did not work last time.
| Unfortunatley Yes ||Oct 18th. at 8:11:34 am UTC|
|Ben Dunbar (Middlesbrough) ||Age: 16 - Email |
It really is a shame, I for one always stay polite, bar the occasional catty and more oft' bitchy responce to "Do you worship Satan?". Gah. But as others have said it is EXTREMELY hard to stay cordial when some lil' (insert appropiate expletive here) is following you down the street hurling abuse at you for being gay, or for whatever other reason. I try and do quite well, but the world in general has lost a lot of it's manners. I just hope we can find tham again soon
Ecclectic strongly rooted in wicca.
| Even In Canada You Say? ||Oct 18th. at 3:43:08 pm UTC|
|Larolyne (Canada) ||Age: 40 - Email |
Yes, even up in the North Country where we are considered polite to the extreme you can run into such behaviours. The best defense is to ignore those people and carry on. If you treat other peope with respect than in turn you will be eventually treated with respect. Also, impress upon your siblings, parents, children and those around you, the person you are disrespectful to today could be on the next interview panel for your next job. ;) It truly is a small planet!!!
| A Revision Of The Golden Rule ||Oct 18th. at 5:42:29 pm UTC|
|Coyoteknight (Reseda, Ca) ||Age: 28 - Email |
Half of me wants to agree that the world is going to crap and everyone I run into is a jerk. Come on, everybody knows this.
The truth is that while everyone is getting surlier and surlier, part of the reason is that we expect the others around us to act in a certain way, an extreamly artificial an contrived way that has nothing to do with how we feel and think. What does this say about ourselves?
We all want people to be a certain way, and I'm not just talking about saying bless you when you sneeze or to bite their lip when you say somthing that they disagree with, we want the quality of humanity to rise.
We want people to BE more noble and kind which is somthing entierly different than being "polite" and "nice"
I think that we have to become the ideal that we almost expect others to be if we are to see this happen.
We can't force others to act the way we want them to without being hypocrits ourselves and this is where the other half of me comes in.
I know that the reason people act like such morons is that they are doing the whole politeness schtick for other people, and they expect the same in return. The obvious problem with this is that other people have bad days or are from different countries that have different ways of signaling respect or were just plain brought up by people that didn't know or didn't care about these customs and rules.
The result of this is that people stop "trying to be nice" at the first sight of rudeness or they keep on repressing their anger until they blow up.
I feel that the only real solution to this problem is to look at the source of the matter. do we treat our friends in the same way as the masses?
No! and the reason is that they are the masses, faceless and innumerable, they are not real people to us, just bodies to avoid, try to grope or any other objectifying action we can think of.
This is how we experience people on the street and elswhere that are "strangers".
In the past we were alienated from eachother by distance and lower quality transportation or comunication, now we are separated by population, there are too many potential friends and allies to choose to connect with and so we ignore the humanity in almost all of them.
We cannot force others to recognise each other for the potential friends they are, nor should we lest we become tyrants ourselves, but we can choose to look at the people in the crowd in a different way.
Try this the next time you are in a crowded bank, or even better, a resturaunt, instead of scanning around the blob of humanity, hold your attention on one individual at a time and watch for a moment to get an understanding of what it is they are doing. That's all!
Try it and you'll realize, not just think or believe, that these are individuals like yourself, they aren't just a mob of things out to get you or obstacles to avoid while walking down the sidewalk.
You will see the man tying his shoelaces in front of the door you are trying to get in as a man and you will see the woman who has toilet paper on her shoe is a woman, both with the same day to day actions as you. You automatically act in a different way, when you see a man as a man and a woman as a woman.
Not nice, not polite but you act as if you are an individual talking to another individual.
Of course you don't change overnight, and the people on the street won't change, but the more you do it, the more things will change.
Yes, You will change slowly but surely because unlike somone who is trying to be nice, you are not "trying" in the first place.
You are naturally reacting to the realization that the body before you is a person.
No secular dogma, no preformed pattern of assumptions that if he does this then it means that, just two individuals or a collective of individuals connecting in some inexpressible way behind the words being spoken.
If you want the world to be more authentically noble, then start with yourself and pass on to others the importance of seeing people for what they are, individuals united in their uniqueness.
Instead of doing unto others as you would have them do unto you, become the person you would hope others would become and forget about whether people are being rude to you or you are being rude to them, being an authentic person is what matters.
You won't believe the stress that is releived by just doing this one simple thing and that in and of itself is worth it. };>)>
| Open Your Eyes... ||Oct 18th. at 9:01:59 pm UTC|
|Denise (Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania) ||Age: 32 - Email |
I try and look at everyone else as what they are, a fellow human being...perhaps the preson driving so slowly in front of you is just learning to drive...perhaps, the person who walked through the door you held for them without even noticing you there, is only running into the store for a new pair of panty-hose to wear to a loved ones funeral, is upset there for not as observant or courteous as they usually are...granted, being a fellow human being, I am not perfect and so I fail at this...but all we can do is try...try...try...
one of my fondest memories was witnessing a child at a nearby wal-marts on christmas eve, asking for help in finding a particular gift for his mother...he mentioned to the sales person as how he didn't want his mother to think him dumb because he did not give it to her, knowing she wanted it...I introduced myself to him explaining that I overheard his problem...I helped him find the gift...he may soon forget...his mother may forget the gift...but I will always remember that day...when I gave myself a gift by helping another
| Mostly Driving ||Oct 18th. at 11:34:10 pm UTC|
The one reason that I hate to drive, above the people weaving through traffic, and even the tailgaters, is the people who won't let anyone merge. They are the people who, as soon as they see that blinker light come on, step on the gas and rush to fill the gap. I don't know why this happens, but it is happening more and more. Sometimes it might just be bad timing on my part, but even my out of state cousin commented on it when he came to visit. That is just my observation.
| Values ||Oct 19th. at 3:32:20 am UTC|
|Lindsay (East Bay, CA) ||Age: 23 - Email |
I think a lot of it comes down to our values, what our parents teach us. Parents seem to be slacking off in the parenting department these days, teaching their children that it is okay to judge and be disrespectful to others. People think that just because they have more money or nicer things that it is their given right to walk all over people that they think are less fortunate. Even thought they might not be, they just choose to spend their money in a more important way, rather than materialistic things that have absolutely no meaning. I am so sick of everybody judging by clothes, cars, houses, or whatever it might be. So a person dresses differently, 9 times out of 10 I bet that person is a lot happier than the person with the $3,000.00 suit! Our society has made judging a priority. Starting with famous people who make millions and millions of dollars a year, but are the first ones to bitch when they can't get 2.5 million instead of 2 million. These are the people who don't even deserve it, too. Why don't we use the money to go towards somebody who is making a difference, instead of memorizing a line. Yeah, most people do give money to charities, but why don't they try working for minimum wage and give the rest to the charities? Then they wouldn't be able to live up to the standard that they have set for everyone else. People need to learn to just be themselves and not to worry about what others think of them. We would all be better off and a hell of a lot happier.
Web Site Content (including: text - graphics - html - look & feel)
Copyright 1997-2014 The Witches' Voice Inc. All rights reserved
Note: Authors & Artists retain the copyright for their work(s) on this website.
Unauthorized reproduction without prior permission is a violation of copyright laws.
Website structure, evolution and php coding by Fritz Jung on a Macintosh G5.
Any and all personal political opinions expressed in the public listing sections (including, but not restricted to, personals, events, groups, shops, Wrenâ€™s Nest, etc.) are solely those of the author(s) and do not reflect the opinion of The Witchesâ€™ Voice, Inc. TWV is a nonprofit, nonpartisan educational organization.
Sponsorship: Visit the Witches' Voice Sponsor Page for info on how you
can help support this Community Resource. Donations ARE Tax Deductible.
The Witches' Voice carries a 501(c)(3) certificate and a Federal Tax ID.
Mail Us: The Witches' Voice Inc., P.O. Box 341018, Tampa, Florida 33694-1018 U.S.A.