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Question of the Week: 113

Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

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112. Elders: Who Are They and Do We Really Need Them? - [74]

111. So, You’re Dead. Now What? - [59]

110. What’s Your Favorite Element? - [119]

109. The Broom Closet Revisited: What’s Your Current Occupancy Rate? - [129]

108. Do You Speak Pagan Geek? - [38]

107. Would You Be A Good ‘Reality Show’ Contestant? - [49]

106. What Is Your Inner Animal? - [127]

105. Are Pagans TOO Individualistic? - [56]

104. Have You Changed Your Mind About the War in Iraq? - [258]

103. What Are You Reading? - [95]

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101. Have You Made Any Extra Security Preparations? - [85]

100. Why Are You A Pagan or Heathen? - [142]

99. What Moon Phase Are You In? - [70]

98. Would You Live In A Haunted House? - [166]

97. What Natural Objects Are On Your Altar? - [103]

96. If You Were Granted Three Wishes... - [179]

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94. Who Would Make Your Pagan/Heathen Who’s Who List? - [91]

93. Should Pagans Apply For Federal Funds? - [56]

92. What Do You See in 2003? - [47]

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89. Bah-Humbug! Are You Offended by Christmas? - [173]

88. Are We Alone in The Universe? - [67]

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83. Time to Talk Politics and Elections… - [109]

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79. Have You Switched Pagan Paths? - [110]

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70. What's News? - [22]

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67. What Is Music? - [18]

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60. What About Those Pagan Leaders Again? - [289]

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53. What is 'Will' or 'Willpower'? - [19]

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48. How Fares The First Amendment? - [20]

47. Are you a Talker or a Listener? - [14]

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44. Do You Spend Money with Pagan Merchants? - [24]

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30. What Do You Support and Why Do You Support It? - [21]

29. How About Some New Holidays? - [39]

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21. What is/was your New Year's resolution? - [19]

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9. Pagan Jokes and Humorous Stories - [37]

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7. The Ethics of Magick and Spellwork - [43]

6. What are YOU planning for Mabon-Autumn Equinox? - [14]

5. Pagan books/web sites-dynamic or drivel? - [46]

4. The Broomcloset-In or Out?... What's YOUR View? - [181]

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2. How Do You Define Witch/WitchCraft? - [42]

1. Who are you going to vote for and why? - [233]

 Author:    Posted: Nov. 17, 2002   This Page Viewed: 20,390,532  

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Question of the Week: 59 - 9/11/2001

911 America: Talking Through The Terror...

Talking Through The Terror... And helping each other cope with the tragedies that struck at the very heart of the United States. The Witches Voice has opened up this forum in order that Pagans may express their thoughts on the terrorist attacks that took place in NYC and DC on September 11th. As the full realization of what happened and the toll numbers begin to come in, Americans have many challenges ahead.

What are your thoughts on these incidents? How are you feeling? Feel free to post any magickal workings or other support gatherings planned in your area.

WebNote 9/16/2001: Since we launched this on 911 this forum as become laced with powerful inspiration and critical information, feel free to use the search functions on your left to better define the info you are looking for. Search for your area, famous Pagans, key words etc. Also check Wren's Nest News for the latest news related to our community.

 Reponses:   There are 969 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 

To Embeth...i Am So Sorry For Your Loss, And Your Fear... Sep 17th. at 5:47:38 am UTC

Merryn (Chrsitchurch, New Zealand) Age: 23 - Email

TO EMBETH...I am so sorry for your loss, and your fear and the fear of your friends, on top of this tradgedy it is extremely unfair. But remember that not all people out there feel this way, we realise that you, whether you share similarities in religon, or country of origin with those BELIEVED (I reiterate it has not been proven that those thought to have done this actually were invloved) to have master-minded this horrible event. But there will always be those who are looking for an excuse to hate.
But take heart that the majority of us greive with you and you friends and family for their losses. We feel for you and send our love and blessings to you.
I wish I could jump through the computer and give you and everyone in America, and in the World for that matter a HUGE hug and tell you and them that it will be alright, maybe not now, maybe not even a long time in the future, but eventually, maybe...who can say.
LOVE will get us through this, LOVE will keep all sane through the tragedy, those who hate degrade the memories of those who died...its an insult to them, it makes me so furious even thinking of it. I'd love to tell these people this, but I'm resonably sure none of those people would ever come to this page.
So Embeth, don't lose heart. They are but few, we are but many...and our love shall over come their hate tenfold. In our grief we are all one, even if some don't act that way.

HUGE hugs to you and your friends Embeth. AMD HUGS AND HUGS AND HUGS!

New**moon**ritual**today, Monday 17 September (sorry For The Wrong Day... Sep 17th. at 4:46:15 am UTC

John ("New Naumkeag", Ohio US) Age: 34 - Email


Today, Monday 17 September (sorry for the wrong day in the previous post -- it's almost 5 a.m. my time), is the New Moon. It is also the first New Moon since the terrorist attacks. It is also one week since those attacks.

Because of all that, I think today would be an auspicious day to cast negative magic for the postive goal of Justice. If you agree or are interested, please visit

to find a ritual to curse and to bind the perpetrators of the terrorist attacks of 11 September 2001. It is ethically composed and ruthless for Justice.

I have worked feverishly over the last several days to research and compose this ritual; I have worked till well after 4 a.m. EDT (GMT -4) tonight to hand-code a webpage to post it on -- so that it would be available in time for people on both sides of the Atlantic to work the ritual on this New Moon. The webpage is nothing pretty, but it does hold the ritual. May it be of some use to the community and to winning this imminent war.

Blessed Be.


Tuesday Morning~i Awoke Rather Very Early, But As I Tried To... Sep 17th. at 1:12:39 am UTC

Seryn (San Antonio, Texas US) Age: 21 - Email

~Tuesday Morning~
I awoke rather very early, but as I tried to fall back asleep...I started to choke and cough. I couldn't breathe. I sat up and noticed it was 8:38am (Central Time). I was slightly confused about why this happened. I never wake up this early, if I can help it. I then had a terrible feeling in m gut and ran to the phone. It then rang, I picked up and it was my boyfriend. He told me to go turn on the TV. I then saw W.T.C. on fire, I watched the planes crash into the buildings. I fell to my knees in shock. I watched as the three of America's greatest glories, The Petagon and Twin Towers fell into the ground. There is nothing left but loss of life, pain, grief, and many un answered questions. But, the unity and love has risen from the ash and fire from the this country and the world. This wonderful, strong country is now a powerful phoenix, and we will learn to fly again.

I lit a blessing candle and have been burning it ever since Tuesday. I pray to the Lady Goddess and Horned God for comfort and justice. We are completely changed from this event and will never be the same. I wish for my faith to stay strong, I wish for relief for the victims of this horrible tragedy. I want the person(s) responsable for this attack to our home brought to Justice. I have been very depressed all week. The more and more I hear of lost loved ones and cry even more. Why did this need to happen? My heart is truly crying, and I see everyone in America is crying endlessly. I do see people uniting and becoming one strong nation again. We will prevail.
~Bright Blessings to all, thank you for letting me get all of this off my chest. ~Blessed Be!~

The Events Of These Past Days Have Saddened And Disturbed Me, And... Sep 17th. at 12:45:51 am UTC

Rhiannon Elizabeth Chesley Kozma (Orinda, California US) Age: 37 - Email

The events of these past days have saddened and disturbed me, and it's been all the more difficult to move through my shock, pain and grief because, at times, IÕve had to hold myself in an impersonal space in order to do my job...

IÕm a broadcast journalist, working for an international cable channel that focuses on technology. Soon after the first plane hit, a producer ran into the newsroom and told us to turn on the ABC news feed. Something had happened at the World Trade Center towers in New York City. We saw the initial devastation and everyone started yelling out what they thought had happened. ŅItÕs a fire, somethingÕs gone wrong with the electrical systems, Ó said one of my colleagues. ŅItÕs another bomb, Ó offered another. Then the unfathomable truth came over the news wire. A plane had slammed into the building. Another wave of speculation. ŅIt must have been a small plane that lost control.Ó ŅA rogue suicidal pilot that was trying to make a name for himself.Ó ÓMaybe there is some massive problem at air traffic control in the area.Ó Grasping at straws, we tried to make sense of the tragedy that was unfolding before our eyes. Then we all stood and watched as the second plane, obviously a large jetliner, slammed into the second of the twin towers. Our initial reaction was horror and disbelief. We couldnÕt have seen what we thought we just saw. It isnÕt true. This just doesnÕt happen here, in the United States, to innocent people. The thought flashed in my head and I spoke it out loud. ŅThis is our generationÕs Pearl Harbor, Ó I said. My executive producer told me not to overreact. Later, Tom Brokaw and others would echo my sentiment in those moments.

When the first plane hit, we were 15 minutes from going on the air live for our daily 9-hour tech news and information show. Suddenly, our mission of covering technology and its impact on our society took a back seat to covering this series of horrors that we were bearing live witness to. For the next few hours, even as we watched the collateral events unfold Š the attack on the Pentagon, the plane crashing outside Pittsburgh, the towers collapsing, the sad, sick realization that this was a deliberate attack on defenseless thousands Š we got down to our work of bringing the latest on the situation to our viewers. Many of my coworkers are from the New York area or have people they know there. We have bureaus in New York City and Washington D.C. I have a good friend who had just moved to New York City to be with his fiancˇ. We didnÕt know about our loved ones or our coworkers and had no way to contact them. No cell phones in the New York area would work. Internet access and e-mail was either down or overloaded as the world tried to get more information and answers.

I moved through that first day in a fog of seeming objectivity, but now I know I was in shock. My psyche was protecting me. After a 14-hour day I went home and tried to rest, because I had to be back to work at 2:00 am the next morning for probably another 12-hour day. The next day was a little better, in that many of us had good news about our loved ones and colleagues, but then again, the full impact of this example of manÕs inhumanity against man was becoming all too apparent. The numbers kept climbing, the hope kept fading and we kept working.

I had been scheduled to take Thursday and Friday off, personal days to move into a new house. I asked if I could defer the time off, to stay and support the team. My request was denied. They would need me the following week to take up the slack. I went home and turned on the television. And saw for the first time the now immortal images of firefighters raising a flag over the massive pile of rubble, reminiscent of Marines raising the flag over Iwo Jima.

Finally, inevitably, the grief enveloped me. I cried as if I would never stop. I cried for the families of those who were lost, who kissed their loved ones goodbye that morning, never imagining that would be the last kiss, the last touch, the last goodbye. I cried for a nation whose security was now shattered, and whose future, while not in immediate jeopardy, is forever changed. I cried for a generation once innocent, now facing the reality of war in their time.

But I cried mostly for the thousands of innocent people who lost their lives in that moment of terror, targeted as the first casualties in a war that they didnÕt sign up to fight.

A wonderful friend, sensing my anguish in a conversation we had on the first day of the tragic attacks, wrote the following poem for touched my heart and soul and helped me know that, although this current chaos and anxiety can be overwhelming, where there is love there is healing.

He has graciously allowed me to share this poem with you. I hope it brings you as much comfort and consolation as it brought me.


No wings to lift me high enough
To offer fleeting comfort
To those who faced the certain
And onrushing hour of their end

Not the wings of the hawk
However steadfast and unyielding

No wings to lift me high enough
To cradle those who faced
A fate reserved for warriors
Though none chose the path of the sword

Not the wings of the raven
However hardened and remorseless

No wings to lift me high enough
To soar above the fear
And glimpse beyond the carnage
The place where our lives are still pure

Not the wings of the dove
However serene and forgiving

But wings I'll find to rise as high
As love will lift me up
And earthbound ties of grieving
Will stretch to allow me my dreams

Wings of a butterfly
No matter how fragile they may be

(For Elizabeth, September 11, 2001)
~ Todd Covert

One of the reasons my friendÕs poem touched me so deeply was because of the last two linesÉ

ŅWings of a butterfly
No matter how fragile they may beÓ

The wings of a butterfly are fragile, yet they lift a being up to the highest heights, to drift on the purest winds. We may want to strike with the ferocity of a hawk, but in our fragile state, we need to take the time to consider the consequences of our actions and hold ourselves to a higher standard than our attackers.

As we move forward toward healing, I pray that we remember the foundation on which our country is built. All people are created equal. Freedom of choice. Freedom of expression. Religious tolerance. LetÕs remember that all of us are here because either our forbears or we came to this country to practice these ideals. It does not serve us to paint those we might see as our offenders with a broad brush of prejudice. If we move forward toward blind vengeance, then those who visited these atrocities upon us have accomplished their sinister mission. They will have made us into what they areÉzealots, fanatics with tunnel vision, bent on personal glory, focused only on making one way the only way.

I have always considered myself a patriot, but I am today more a patriot than I have ever been. And at the same time, I encourage us all to be patriotic, not fanatic. As a nation and a people, we are a beacon of hope and freedom to the worldÉnow is the time to step up to that responsibility.

Pray for peace and healing

In The Midst Of All The Death And Despair, There Is Still... Sep 17th. at 12:45:08 am UTC

Ivy Greenwood (Simi Valley, California US) Age: 45 - Email

In the midst of all the death and despair, there is still room for life and hope.
Two friends of mine have just given birth! Two beautiful little Pagan baby girls have
come into the world, a sign, surely, that life always finds a way. The Wheel still turns,
the Cycle still runs true. We are changed, saddened, made wiser, but we are not ended.
Even as we are lost, we are renewed.

I have no idea what the coming days will bring this nation. I pray for peace and sanity.
Going to war will just kill thousands of innocent people---which is, if I recall correctly,
the exact same thing the terrorists did. (And I know there are those who say, "But they hate
us!" Yes, that is true, but they have been misled, and being misled is not a capital offense.)

I, too, want justice, and I will be honest and say that I don't know how this can best be accomplished. But I do know that wholesale slaughter is not the way. Violence begets more
violence. Killing leads to more killing. There has to be another way. May the Lady and Lord
give our leaders the wisdom to find that other, better way!

My Neighbor, Father Of A 4 Year Old Is Gone, Another Neighbor's... Sep 17th. at 12:21:08 am UTC

Embeth (Brooklyn, New York US) Age: 3

My neighbor, father of a 4 year old is gone, Another neighbor's oldest brother, father
of 3 is gone, countless firefighters from this neighborhood are gone, My favorite employee
at the local drugstore is missing-
The faces of people on the street are blank-We live in the largest Arabic community in
Brooklyn-They are all scared-My neighbors, a beautiful family from Palestine are horrified, embarassed and afraid-their young children are confused-This is a nightmare-

This Week Has Been A Personally Difficult Week For Me, As It... Sep 17th. at 12:13:07 am UTC

Calis Moonelf (Rockville, Indiana US) Age: 29 - Email

This week has been a personally difficult week for me, as it has been for most in this country, and many around the world. Many emotions have surfaced in me at once that have left my head spinning, and every day brings something new. I know I should ignore some things when they come and consider the source, but here is what has really pissed me off (sorry, no other words express it properly) in the last few days:

"I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America. I point the finger in their face and say 'you helped this happen.'" --- Jerry Falwell

"The focus of many in America has been on the pursuit of health, wealth, material pleasures and sexuality.....We have allowed rampant pornography on the Internet, and rampant secularism and the occult, etc. to be broadcast on television.....We lie naked before these terrorists who have infiltrated our country. There are probably tens of thousands of them in America right now. They have been raising money and preaching their hate." --- Pat Robertson, , PTID2546|CHID101024|CIID838600, 00.html

Now, ordinarily I can ignore these two. But we, as a nation, are facing the very likely threat of war, at home and abroad. These guys are taking advantage of the media attention to point their fingers at people that agree with them. It would be very easy for me to point out the remarkable similarities to their beliefs, and the beliefs of the people who are perpetrating these terrorist acts. Intolerance and hate is what has caused all of this, to be spreading intolerance and hate within our own nation is irresponsible, now more than ever. If you want to pray, pray. If I want to chant and meditate, let me. I thought that was the reason this nation was founded, FREEDOM!!

There Are No Words To Describe My Feelings Of The Recent Events... Sep 17th. at 12:12:59 am UTC

LadyStarrlight (Tampa, Florida US) Age: 26 - Email

There are no words to describe my feelings of the recent events, the horrors actually, that took place less than one week ago. I'm sure many feel the same way. All I know for sure, is that many families are in pain now... many are in limbo, and don't know where they're loved ones are. It is the most devistating manifestation thinkable. Yes, there will be vengence, yes there will be justice... and rightfully so. To all pagans, who I've seen writing AGAINST a retaliation... consider this...

We are the greatest nation in the world. We are lucky to live in America, land of the free. But, freedom doesn't come for free. Freedom was obtained thru our forefathers, not thru "peace, love and forgivness"... but, thru fighting... fighting for our freedoms... our land, our future. It is bloody, yes, but necessary. Bleeding heart liberals may not have the stomach for the fight, but they will surely reap from it. Because there WILL be retaliation.. there will be WAR. And while many pagans of different paths say our Lord and Lady would not "want" this... I say, ask the Morrigan. Ask Mars... Our gods and goddesses are not all light and love... they are dark also.. something you should remember. We walk the middle path between darkness and light... because we KNOW you cannot have one without the other. Dark times call for dark measures.

I've been so pleased to see all Americans coming together in this time. We will take military action... that's a given.. I just hope, that EVERYONE supports our troops when the time comes. I know I will. God/dess bless America!

I Was Still Sleeping Tuesday Morning At 9 When I Heard My... Sep 17th. at 12:05:48 am UTC

Stormcrow Eaglebear (Columbia) Age: 30

I was still sleeping Tuesday morning at 9 when I heard my wife telling me I needed to get up, because "we might be going to war." She told me that a plane had plowed into the World Trade Center, and a few moments later, I watched the replay of the first plane, and live footage of the second World Trade Center collision. Then the camera panned to reveal smoke rising from the Pentagon..

Watching both Trade Center towers fall, and seeing this full-scale assault on the nation's capital was a horror I'd thought reserved only for the fanciful plots of Hollywood thrillers. Not so, it seems.

That morning, I met with the HPS that I work with, and we performed the first of what would be several healing Circles for the week.

If I didn't have the Lady and Lord to turn to, I don't know what I would have done this week. Those of us in the magickal community should work together, across lines of Paths and Traditions to weave a net of power and protection around our nation...and we should join with Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, and those of other faiths to form a unified front of prayer and healing. Let this act intended to sow fear and division instead sow seeds of unity and courage. Let justice be done without blind thirst for blood. Let Karma work its way. Let the Goddess and God do Their will, and all of the innocent departed find shelter in the Summerlands, while those left behind on the sacred Earth find comfort and the strength to persevere.

In Love and Light,
Stormcrow Eaglebear
HP, Snowstar Coven
Columbia, SC

Greetings To My Brothers And Sisters, I Work On A Military Base... Sep 16th. at 11:52:39 pm UTC

Beryl (Clarksville, Tennessee US) Age: 35 - Email

Greetings to my brothers and sisters,
I work on a military base. I was at work that morning when we started hearing the sketchy news on the radio about the disaster. By the time we knew what had really gone on, the post was closed to both incoming and outgoing traffic as they secured the post. By the time I got home as watched the news that was being broadcast I think my mind had shut down to all emotions but disbelief. Then came grief. Grief for those that had died immediately, those that are even now missing and for the families of those who will never know what has happened to thir loved ones. Our coven had one of it's members who lived in New York and we had not heard from him and could not get in touch with him. Our hearts sank as we watched more and more of the news. Thankfully we have heard from him as he has been called up to his gard unit to help with the rescue efforts. Our coven initiates recently got together for a dark moon ritual. We performed a binding ritual against those who would commit acts of terrorism. It was a real release of all the feelings that had been building since this all began. We also took part at many have in a candlelight healing ritual. I take comfort in the fact that so many people stand with us at this time. I have been proud of our community of pagans and wiccans for their strength and resolve.

What Is It Anyone Could Say? At First, Shock, Then Horror And... Sep 16th. at 11:42:37 pm UTC

Tarostar (Toronto, Ontario CA) Age: 59 - Email

What is it anyone could say? At first, shock, then horror and sorrow.
But, from deep inside an anger, then a fury and then a rage against
the perpetrators of such an atrocity.

No grief counselling, no seeking to understand the reasons
of the hateful Islamic fanatics. No excuses and certainly no
calls for pacifistic hand wringing would I want to hear.

Cold, calculated, relentless and continuing pursuit of
those misguided and mistaken fanatics, to the last one,
is the only thing I want to see.

They attack, because of their misjudgment of us through
their thinking in stereoptypes. They view Human History as a religious epic
and see us in those simplistic terms. What a colossal miscalculation!

The juggernaut is slow to mobilize, but devastating in force and effectiveness.
They have begun to make it move. Woe betide! We don't all sing The Battle
Hymn Of The Republic, all at once for nothing.

They didn't heed Admiral Yamamoto's estimation of what was wrought
on Dec. 7, 1941. Sept. 11, 2001 will be the infamous day which wrought
their own demise, for having awoken that sleeping giant. There is nothing he hates wose
then a dastardly sneak attack. Up, Mars! Down with the fanatics! Tarostar

To Paraphrase Gandalf: Many Who Live Deserve Death. And Many Who Die... Sep 16th. at 11:40:14 pm UTC

Arachne (Mountainair, New Mexico US) Age: 52 - Email

To paraphrase Gandalf: Many who live deserve death. And many who die deserve life -- can you give this back to them? Be wary of you desires for revenge, for even the Wise cannot see all ends.

I invoke strenght and compassion, courage and wisdom, valor and insight, to see all of us through the coming times. Thank you, my brothers and sisters, for giving me a community to look to, and thank you, Witchvox, for you unending commitment to us.

In perfect love and perfect trust -- Arachne

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