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Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

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 Author:    Posted: Nov. 17, 2002   This Page Viewed: 6,006,473  

Vox Q Stats

Times Viewed: 32,767

Reponses: 263

Lurker/Post Ratio: 124 to 1

Question of the Week: 14 - 11/6/2000

The Unresolved US Election

Did YOU vote? Which candidate did you vote for? How do you feel about the political wrangling going on right now in Florida? Will/Should either candidate concede for the good of the country-or should either/both fight it out until we all scream for mercy? How do you think either candidate, if declared the winner, will be able to bring the country together given the inference that the election results now point to an America that is almost equally divided into one camp or the other? And the BIG question-What, if any, impact will the final results have on the Pagan communities?

 Reponses:   There are 263 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 


I Voted For Al Gore. I Think That This Turmoil Although Somewhat... Nov 13th. at 1:27:19 pm UTC

Jadestorm (Orlando, Florida US) Age: 22 - Email


I voted for Al Gore. I think that this turmoil although somewhat painful right now is for the long term good of the country. It is imperative that we find the flaws in the way things are done so that they can be corrected. It has remained far too easy over the past several generations to ignore the uselessness of the electoral college, to toss out the votes of any americans who may have erroneously filled out a ballot or improperly punched a misleading ballot. I am furious in fact that some counties continue to use methods of this nature when there, as in Orlando, Florida machines that the voter inserts their ballot and if a response is not understood the machine immediately kicks it out so the voter has the opportunity to clarify and allow their vote, their voice to be counted. I think we all needed a harsh reminder about what the intent was when our founders designed a system that would allow the voice of te american people. Hopefully the only impact on Pagan communities will be that they are encouraged to get out and vote, partake in our political system. I believe that without a 2/3 majority Bush will be unable to push through any of his proposed agendas and we will have four years of useless administration. Alternatively, if Al Gore is declared the winner, some of his conservative bills may be approved but for the same reasons his hands will be bound in much the same way.


Frankly, The Whole Thing Seems A Lot Like A Circus... I Voted... Nov 13th. at 1:12:08 pm UTC

Sara (Old Town, Maine US) Age: 23 - Email


Frankly, the whole thing seems a lot like a circus... i voted for Nader, and I stand by his ideals more than the other candidates. I do have some reservation about Bush just because of his right-wing Christian beliefs... I am concerned that my right to practice Witchcraft could possibly be in jeopardy, but I also know that it would take more than the President to achieve such a regulation.

Blessed Be.


Many Voting Machines In Use Today Are The Same Model Designed In... Nov 13th. at 1:06:35 pm UTC

Rowan Fairgrove (SF Bay Area, California US) Age: 47


Many voting machines in use today are the same model designed in the 1890's.

Yes, that date is correct! They stopped making them (or new parts for them) in the 1970's. The process of counting ballots is all on the backs of the counties - who quite reasonably pay for pothole repair or a new police car before they replace antiquated voting equipment. If nothing else, this
election shows us that it is time to fix the system.

And yes, I voted. Since Gore was unlikely to lose in California, I voted for Ralph Nader. Ralph & I don't agree on everything, but I felt that it was a statement worth making. The 10 Key Values of the Greens are the most reasonable platform I"ve found.


I Voted Green And Was A Little Taken Aback By The Accusations... Nov 13th. at 1:00:05 pm UTC

Blackthorne (San Francisco, California US) Age: 35 - Email


I voted green and was a little taken aback by the accusations that I put Bush
in the white house. We live in a great country that actually has more than one
political party, and it's okay to vote for the other party's as long as it's
with the express permission of your pagan peers.(insert sarcasm here.)
I have been emailed several times about wasting my vote, or the dangers of
voting green. This survey aside, I think that unless you volunteer the info
(as i am doing) people should bugger off and mind thier own business.
Many people who I did not offer to give my views on politics felt obliged
to tell me what I should do. I thought this was rude, and I really hope that
we don't see this again in future elections. Although many of us are all of a
similar mind, I don't think that people should be given a hard time if they are
pagan and vote republican. I don't agree with that particular party, but it's
within a persons right to vote that way no matter how wrong they would be.
But to harrass them...it's just plain bad form and should not be done by anyone.
I don't feel that my vote was wasted, or that I caused anyone undue harm by
voting the way I wanted to. I was simply doing what any american should be allowed to do. Vote the way they want. Try it sometime, it's a great feeling.


Let's See. Where To Start. I Did Vote, And I Voted Libertarian... Nov 13th. at 12:56:50 pm UTC

Richard Gant (Kentucky, Kentucky US) Age: 28 - Email


Let's see. Where to start. I did vote, and I voted Libertarian. I felt that neither candidate from the two major parties was really qualified to be President. I still don't, but I've become resigned to the thought.As far as the "political wrangling going on right now in Florida", I'm enjoying it. Not only is it entertaining to watch in its own right, but (as a History major) it's also an opportunity to get daily reports on a historical event-in-the-making. (Sure, that may sound callous and/or shallow. Unfortunatly, I don't have enough information about what *really* happened to form an opinion about who, if anyone, is at fault.) Regardless, I don't think that either candidate will or should concede the election. A national election is, at least theoretically, about the will of the people of the nation. If one of the candidates concedes before learning who wins, that candidate is essentially saying that he doesn't care about the national will. In the long run, dragging out victory until there is a victor will be *better* for us as a nation.Regardless of who wins, I doubt that there will be a significant need to "bring the country together", as partisanship has always been a factor in national elections. The President is only rarely decided by a significant majority of the popular vote in any election. The only difference in this election is that the popular vote split more within states (instead of along states, as is typically the case). America is almost *always* divided into one political camp or another, and we've gotten along just fine anyway. My prediction is that, once a victor is declared, the excitement will fade and things will return to normal.Also, regardless of who wins, I find it unlikely that there will be any significant impact on the Pagan communities. Some of us will be upset over the winner and some won't, regardless. We're hardly a single demographic, after all. If Bush wins, it will not herald a new age of neo-Fascist anti-Pagan "burning times" (as some left-wing Pagans seem to rant about hysterically). If Gore wins, it will ot herald a new age of neo-Luddite "environmentalism at the cost of the economy and progress" (as some right-wing Pagans seem to believe). Life will continue.


Yes, I Voted. And For The First Time In My Life, I... Nov 13th. at 12:42:48 pm UTC

Ariadne Jarnsaxa (Norfolk, Virginia US) Age: 33 - Email


Yes, I voted. And for the first time in my life, I voted non-Republican. And I will admit that my decision was based upon both candidates answers to "Wiccans in the military". I'm afraid that I couldn't endorse someone who didn't even recognize my religion as a religion. I've been a follower of the "old religion" as it was referred to in my family for 33 years now. I'm literally the first generation in centuries to be open about it and I have to guard that priviledge very carefully. For the first time in my life, I followed the presidential race closely and examined each and every answer to every question I could find. The Florida count only makes me wonder how many elections haven't been correct? How many years has this been going on for? And the impact on our Pagan community....it depends, one will at least give us a chance, the other will deny our existence which will set us back at least 100 years. All I know, is I'm not going back into the "broom closet" for anyone!


I Keep Hearing That This Election Proved That Every Vote Counts, But... Nov 13th. at 12:14:39 pm UTC

Candle Ogham (Tamai, Italy) Age: 22 - Email


I keep hearing that this election proved that every vote counts, but I don't feel the same way. I also keep hearing that Bush was given Florida before the military overseas absentee ballots were counted. Being military overseas, I am troubled. They say that usually, the overseas absentee ballots are republican; well, I'm not and I want to be heard. I'm not a statistic. I can wait for the results, I would love to know now, but I want every voice to be heard. If Gore wins the popular vote, he should become president, the electoral college is a joke, and also very contradictory to what America stands for. It should be taken away, and judged un-democratic and unfair. I am a democrat, but I would be saying the same thing if Bush was in Gore's place.


I Did Vote. Although In Massachusetts, Gore Was A Shoe-in. I Also... Nov 13th. at 11:24:50 am UTC

Firesong (Boston, Massachusetts US) Age: 26 - Email


I did vote. Although in Massachusetts, Gore was a shoe-in. I also stayed up that night to watch the returns. I saw Florida given to Gore. Then taken away. I saw it given to Bush, and then saw him declared the winner. Then I saw them take it away. I have also seen that after all is said and done, Gore won the popular vote. The majority of Americans want Al Gore to be our next president. But Florida may change the course of all of that.

Having lived in Florida, Miami specifically, I know first hand the ballot fraud that goes on down there. Florida, on the whole, is terribly corrupt. I have no problem thinking that there was extreme fraud going on. My parents still live in Florida and told me what happened to them.

Their polling place was changed and they were not notified. They new polling place was across a park from where they were. They managed to make it in time, but many people who had been at their old polling place were denied access, the officers saying that they were too late, even though they had been standing in the other line.
While my parents were in line, they had people walking up and down the line campigning for GWB.
Many Hatians were turned away, told that they were at the wrong polling place when they were in fact at the correct one. By the time the confusion was cleared, it was too late and the polls had closed.

Anyone who tells you that the election in Florida was fair has no clue of what really goes on there. Unless you have lived there, with the corruption, you have no idea to the length politicians will go to get their guy to the elected position.

I don't think there needs to be a re-vote, just go with the popular vote. Obviously, most amaericans want Al Gore. This used to be a country where the majority rule.


As A Canadian, I Find Myself Slightly Amused And Also A Little... Nov 13th. at 11:08:38 am UTC

Marea (Niagara Falls, Ontario CA) Age: 30 - Email


As a Canadian, I find myself slightly amused and also a little repelled by all the hoopla across the border. It seems that in the ultimate fast-food culture, if we can't know the results in a few hours then we have a constitutional crisis likely to rip apart the country at the seams. Here in Canada we won't be free of election jitters for some time since we are facing a greatly similar circumstance in our Nov. 27th election. Many other countries have elections which last days and weeks which take place in far less secure circumstances and manage to build a nation from the event. My best advice to those Americans who are feeling angry and impatient is, stop and take a deep breath, and then let your system work for you. Once you have your answer, adapt and carry on. If constitutional change is in order, all the better to have an opportunity to carry on a national discussion about what it REALLY means to be an American! Good luck and best wishes to you all!


I Cannot Believe That In The 21st Century, Paper Ballots Are Still... Nov 13th. at 9:38:57 am UTC

Amethyst (Lynnwood, Washington US) Age: 42 - Email


I cannot believe that in the 21st century, paper ballots are still being used, especially for the Presidential election. It should all be done by Internet, and the results would be available immediately.
George W. Bush is so used to his daddy getting him anything he wants that he can't fathom that he may have lost. His attack dogs are trying to keep votes from being counted, but I don't see how they will succeed, since Florida law allows for a hand recount in these cases.
If Bush does become President, he will have a hard road ahead of him. He will be under even more scrutiny than before, and more and more skeletons from his past will come out.
Al Gore shouldn't give up, even if it turns out to be President Dubya. There's always 2004.


A Wake Up Call For All Americans Is Ringing Across The Land... Nov 13th. at 9:12:39 am UTC

Trish Telesco (Western, New York US) Age: 40 - Email


A Wake up call for all Americans is ringing across the land. If one considers the mistakes, miscounts, and uncounted ballots in Florida alone and multiplies that by all 50 states, the numbers become staggering. It is even more so when you consider how few of these errors can lead to placing the wrong person in a position of power on a local level.

If "BY THE PEOPLE" is to have meaning, people's votes can't be idly thrown out like yesterday's garbage. This sends a horrible message to our youth that while we say every person's vote counts, it's simply not true because it's too much of a bother!

I feel the recount is necessary, and indeed morally required. And no matter who wins this election, I pray that afterwards they begin overhauling the whole country's systems so that ONE STANDARD approach is used -- one that allows each voice, the voice of the PEOPLE to be heard clearly and resolutely.


Yes, I Did Vote. My Choices Was Centered On Many Issues, Healthcare... Nov 13th. at 9:08:31 am UTC

Samantha (St. Louis, Missouri US) Age: 35


Yes, I did vote. My choices was centered on many issues, healthcare, women's issues, environment. I was suprised when asked by a couple of friends and my mother why I was choosing to vote for Gore, that they did not realize our next president would be appointing, and soon, Supreme Court Justices. To simplify my point to my friends and my mother I advised them that Bush would padlock our panties and there would only be 2 keys, one for our husbands and one kept in Washington D.C. Notice I said husbands, not partners or significant others, as I am sure they would continue to do whatever is necessary to infringe on whatever headway we've made in that arena as well.
Samantha


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