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Question of the Week: 113

Pagan Problem Children: What Can We Do About Them?

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 Author:    Posted: Nov. 17, 2002   This Page Viewed: 6,219,792  

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Times Viewed: 32,767

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Question of the Week: 59 - 9/11/2001

911 America: Talking Through The Terror...

Talking Through The Terror... And helping each other cope with the tragedies that struck at the very heart of the United States. The Witches Voice has opened up this forum in order that Pagans may express their thoughts on the terrorist attacks that took place in NYC and DC on September 11th. As the full realization of what happened and the toll numbers begin to come in, Americans have many challenges ahead.

What are your thoughts on these incidents? How are you feeling? Feel free to post any magickal workings or other support gatherings planned in your area.

WebNote 9/16/2001: Since we launched this on 911 this forum as become laced with powerful inspiration and critical information, feel free to use the search functions on your left to better define the info you are looking for. Search for your area, famous Pagans, key words etc. Also check Wren's Nest News for the latest news related to our community.

 Reponses:   There are 969 responses posted to this question. Reverse Sort 


It's 36 Hours Later And I Am Still In A State Of... Sep 12th. at 9:31:43 pm UTC

Flidais Runs-With-Wolves (Lowell, Massachusetts US) Age: 20 - Email


It's 36 hours later and I am still in a state of shock, but grief and anger are slowly taking over. Never in my wildest dreams had I ever expected a tragedy of this magnitude. Work and school may continue as normal, but I am saddened by the fact that the lives of those who have been personally affected by this event will never be the same.

Should we bomb suspected countries? No, no, a thousand times no. To do so would be the redux of Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and Cambodia. Innocent men, women, and children would be killed. It's horrible enough knowing that our federal government's sanctions against Iraq and Cuba are murdering the innocent.

I pray that the kind Mama Goddess will bring Her boundless love, compassion, and confort to those whose loved ones lives were cut short. The Great Mother is indeed kind, this I know.

May the Lady and Her Lord bless each and every one of you.


It Has Been Announced That Casualties Will Not Exceed Twenty Thousand People... Sep 12th. at 9:26:24 pm UTC

Thunderchilde (Crystal City, Missouri US) Age: 45 - Email


It has been announced that casualties will not exceed twenty thousand people. I doubt we will ever know for sure the final tally of this catastrophe.

We should all send our wishes for them and their families.

For now, we need to pull together.......Pagan, Christian, Muslim, etc.... to deal with the necessary tasks at home. It is shockinly refreshing to see our representatives putting aside politics to deal with this. It will be necessary for us to do the same with our religious differences. It should also be remembered that the prime suspect behind these acts sees himself as a religious man. We need to make sure that we aren't following in his tracks by the desire for revenge.

It looks as if our government has it's act together and is getting the puzzle pieced together. Let them do their work. Keep on them to make sure this attack isn't allowed to quietly be forgotten.

And remember, if you have given blood in the last two days, you are eligible again in eight weeks. It is going to be just as urgent then as it is now because there are thousands of injured as well.

Blessings to all.


I Sit Here And Just Heard That They Believe That Egypt And... Sep 12th. at 9:21:51 pm UTC

Hecate Laguz Persephone (conyers, Georgia US) Age: 15 - Email


i sit here and just heard that they believe that Egypt and Saudi Arabia were involved in it. I also sit here in tears crying not because i know someone who has so unfortunately passed, but i know people who have family members who have and their world is noe inevitably shattered. I am wiccan yet, this week, i have gone to school and participated in all the Christian prayer cirlces. Right now, religion dosent matter because we are all human first. i stated before that i dont know anyone who has died but i know a kid who's father was in one of those planes. i know girl who's mother was in the world trade center. And my aunts best friend, who is a flight attendant, was supposed to be on there too. She knew all the pilots and attendents on that plane and if it hadnt been her day off, she would have perished with them.
We wake up everymorining and turn to the news to see pictures of other countries at war and now, we turn it on and it is our own. Yet America is the sheer representation of diversity in our world and attacking us, is like attacking your own country.
My brother is getting ready to go into the navy, my sister and brotherinlaw are in the Airforce and so is my uncle, my father works in the federal building in atlanta and, i cant help but wonder, in the next few days, weeks, months, or even years, what will become of them. I am only 15 but, this affects everyone.
i got on a school bus today and our driver told us to look around at those sitting next to us, hug them, look directly in their eyes and say, "i hope i will see you tomarrow." right now, we dont know if we will ever see eachother again and, this is teaching us the power of goodbye in the hardest way.
i do believe in getting back at those involved, yet, i am also one who says history repeats itself and violence cannot stop violence. i look at that flag every chance i get and just hope to god/ess its still there tomarrow and i am still free.
I ask you all to think about those whose life has ultimately changed, i ask you to donate blood and volenteer or donate money, or anything along the lines of americas needs. We might be strangers but, right now, we are all feeling the same thing and, it is only humanic to help how we can
i hope to wake up in the morning, get on my bus, go back to my school and hug each and everyone of my friends and my enemies. not because i am friends with them, but, because they have a place in this world and if they werent here, there would be a gap and another silenced voice.


I Work Uptown, But My Fiance Works (worked) Downtown About 2 Blocks... Sep 12th. at 9:11:58 pm UTC

Bethy (Staten Island, New York US) Age: 34


I work uptown, but my fiance works (worked) downtown about 2 blocks from WTC. I panicked when I heard the news, all I could do was pray that he would call me and would be all right. He did--he saw the second plane hit as he was walking uptown to my office.

It was absolutely terrifying, not knowing what was happening and not wanting to watch the news for fear of seeing his body. Luckily, he got to me unharmed physically, but I'm hoping his heart is ok.

I'm feeling very numb right now. I'm so sad for everyone who lost friends and family in Towers and the planes, and though part of me wants retribution, all I can really ask is that karma backlashes on whoever masterminded this in the nastiest way possible. Most of me, however, asks the Goddess to comfort the living, give strength to the rescue workers, and hold the souls of the dead close in her arms.

Tonight will be prayers and magick working energy for those who need it.

Love and bright blessings to all, and thanks for Fritz and Wren for having a place like this.


I Have Recently Finished Clancy's "the Bear & The Dragon", I Have To... Sep 12th. at 9:07:06 pm UTC

Aspasia Tiresias (Southern, Maine US) Age: 35 - Email


I have recently finished Clancy's "the Bear & The Dragon", I have to look at this incedent & wonder at the collosal stupid ity of whoever pulled this stunt. What did they think we would just give them a proportional response, only attack their military assets or stick to just who we can absolutely prove was involved. Give me a break. & get a clue while your at it. We are the freest nation on the planet, when you attack us, you attack the very concept of freedom itself. & as to those palestinians in the streets you represent your religion so well by celebrating the attacks. unfortunately religion is what it's participants do irregardless of what their beliefs may or may not say. So I say it's simple, whoever was involved with this attack, bomb 'em back to the bloody iceages! & any country that chooses to harbor international terrorists, cut em off, total economic & diplomatic isolation. Yeah that means no tourism there as well not that many of these countries are exactly tourist draws to begin with. But if we don't they'll think they can get away with it & keep doing it & not merely to us again but everywhere else will escalate or start up again. However that is just my more at-large rant of what to do with em! Us pagans well, having seen karmic justice at work, I shake my head even more at their collosal stupidity. I say call on every deity who has every dealt karmic justice, from Kali Ma to Ma'at to the Morrigan, use every herb & stone & other substance or energy that sends bad mojo back on it's producer & invoke their ugly deeds back upon them.
Think about the area, if there aren't some seriously bad vibes there afterwards, I will be very surprised & unfortunately this incident didn't surprise me except that it took so long to happen. In other words it takes a very great lot to surprise me. Don't mistake me I'm not cynical , I'm just priviledge to alot of information the world at large is not & I pick up on alot of stuff most others miss. However I digress, by doing this we will hopefully psychically cleanse the area without even having to go there. The way these people died was not pretty or neat, & the intentions invoked by this deed were nasty almost as bad as Hitler & WWII. The act itself combined with all those people violently dieing is going to create a pocket of psychic pollution that will make Chenobyl blowing up seem tame to make an environmental analogy. & i ask you have the other religious traditions been able to clean up similar areas of psychic pollution like Aushcwitz or certain native american sites where people were slaughtered or the dead were disturbed. I'm not saying it is our duty to clease this incedent. But what will result will give what ever punishment is inflicted an extra thump, likely just that extra thump needed to make these kind of people choose some other more peaceful method to make their point. Also I call on all pagans to create spells to protect their countries at large especially those of us in border regions of our countries to protect our borders from incursion of those who have malevolent intentions towards us. What is it they say about God & country. It's time probably long overdue a lesson is taught to those who use violence especially violence on this scale to force their views on others. The protection stuff I'd do on the next full moon & every full moon for the next year of so & then the usual maintanance. The Karmic Justice start on the day before the next new moons & a big spell on Samhain would be highly appropriate. Perhaps consider how those "celebrities" of our number who have passed over the past year would feel about this event & what they would have done about it as we mourne their passing at our annual day of mourning known as Samhain. If this attack weren't so atrocious I would laugh at their lousy timing! It is so close to the day the veil is the thinnest this is going to work quite well! I would also recommend a large bonfire, wearing black (unless you are able to go skyclad) , being demonstratative enough to attract attention not get yourself in trouble & be dignified about it. Pour in all your rage, sadness & grief over this into some sort of cone of power & release it into the universe when you are through. There is a sort of power in the universe that will take our collective rage & anguish & send precisely appropirate punishment upon their heads beyond what our politcal leaders are going to & it will quite likely be more accurate & productive than what they may be able to do anyway. Before you worry about the Rede, don't it's not as though we (the US) has done anything to deserve this, we didn't! Freedom is an incarnate inborn divine right every person is born with & no one has the right to infringe that right without reasonable cause or due process. & if Afganistan gets thumped in the process too well I can't feel anything in the way of sympathy for that as I know the Goddess has been not a little pissed off for a while at the way they are treating their women, & most other countries that help terrorists treat their women only slightly better so perhaps, 2 birds killed with one hell of a magical stone! & if you are not pissed off enough yet yesterday was International Peace Day!
Oh & an awsome psych out to countries who harbor these well demons would be complementary, send a simple envelope with herbs in it, Agrimony, & other herbs that send evil back upon it's sender(s) with a small pentagram drawn on it & a short message that those of our religion don't need violence to take retribution & a smile & perhaps the date of Samhain especially if we get most pagans everywhere to do a karmic justice ritual on that day or close to it. be sure to use the appropriate postage & an airmail envelope. the mind#&@% alone will be worth it & those have a power unto themselves as well.
Part of the point that was trying to be made by this action was one religion supposedly being more right than all others, one way of life being more right than all others. Are we not the perfect people to make the point that a diverse groups of people can live successfully & peacefully together. That concept is what part of this attack was on so the point must be made that those who chose to cause violence to others different from themselve in an attempt to make those same people more similar are wrong & must not be permitted to do so. If you are remotely afraid of the Law of Three, than use pictures of the explosions of the planes crashing into the buildings as a focus & ask the universe to punish those who took over those planes & those who helped them. The universe will do so, even if we never know how precisely it punished or how!


I Am A Teenage Solitary Practitioner And Was Woken Up Tuesday Morning... Sep 12th. at 9:04:22 pm UTC

Amanda (Graham, North Carolina US) Age: 17 - Email


I am a teenage solitary practitioner and was woken up Tuesday morning by the news. I immediately woke my partner up and made him watch. My normally cynical mate was appalled, as was I. I am unable to believe that anybody on this Earth can be so cruel and stupid. For a grudge against an organization-possibly only one man, 10s of thousands of people died. To imagine what was going on on those planes and in the passengers heads before they crashed is heart breaking and ghastly to think about. I hope someone has enough guts or strength to stand up and stop the bantering, because it is becoming too much for the innocent people in the world to handle. Mother Nature and Earth will be destroyed if the blows get any worse-and I hope never to see so many people die within hours...It's too horrible


I Feel That The People Involved In Hijacking The Jets Must Have... Sep 12th. at 9:04:10 pm UTC

Naomi j (Adelaide, South Australia AU) Age: 18


i feel that the people involved in hijacking the jets must have known what they were doing.


I Pray For The People Still Trapped In The Rubble. May The... Sep 12th. at 9:03:11 pm UTC

Celania Starfire (Mooresville, North Carolina US) Age: 19 - Email


I pray for the people still trapped in the rubble. May the light of the God and Goddess lead them to safety. Although I cannot identify with those who have lost loved ones, I have come close. My grandmother lives at the north end of Manhattan island.


To All The People Who Lost Their Lives Because Of This Selfish... Sep 12th. at 8:52:47 pm UTC

Tala StarFire (North Bay, Ontario CA) Age: 19 - Email


To all the people who lost their lives because of this selfish act, and to all the people that are greiving their loss, I give my deepest sympathies. To everyone affected, we will get thru this. Like an earlier message said, we need to focus on healing, protection and justice. We can help this matter if we put our own energies into it, not just magickal, but physical if possible. Give blood, help out with whatever you can. Actually, I have a request. I can't give blood due to anemia, if there is someone out there that can, please do. If you can help to save anothers life, do all you can.
Goddess protect us.
Goddess bless us.
Goddess be with us always.


This Is One Of Those Things That Is The Hardest To Talk... Sep 12th. at 8:49:58 pm UTC

Cooroo (Kihei, Hawaii US) Age: 15 - Email


This is one of those things that is the hardest to talk about. I still can't believe it actually happened, although it did yesterday. I stayed up all night, till midnight at least, watching CNN for more information, especially on the World Trade Center. Most likely they will not read it, but I'd like to send out prayers to these people:

Jeremy Glick, for his heroic act on board the hi-jacked aircraft, bound for the White House, that crashed in Pennsylvania. My prayers are with him on his way to the Summerland.

Hadassah and Misi Perez: My dear Goddessmother, I know you live in NYC but I don't know where. I hope to God and Goddess that you are alright and that you have lived through this...My blessings to you.

Max: Kaepa would want me to pray for you. I don't know where in NY you are but my blessings and prayers are with you this day.

All the people on the aircrafts; in the World Trade Center; The Pentagon; the firefighters and police men; any other killed in this terrible incident: I pray to the Lord and Lady that you have made it to the Summerland, and that your families are safe. It was hate that killed you and it was unjust, evil and despicable. You will be avenged.

Everyone else affected by this incident: I pray that you recieve the strength to get through this. It is a tough time (to say the least) for everyone, and I send you prayers for strength and courage. Mrs. Glick, I send prayers for you and your daughter. Your husband was a good man.

And finally and surprisingly, the terrorists that started it all: I pray that someday you will find redemption, and be cleansed of the evil that pollutes your soul. May the Lord and Lady have mercy on you.

My opinions on this are so myriad that I cannot possibly explain them all. However, I need to say these few things.

The missile defense system that The President is now pushing to build would not have helped yesterday at all. There is no point in making more instuments of war, what we need the most right now is an instument of peace.

Bombing the catfood out of Afghanistan will not help either. We would just be sinking to the level of the terrorists.

I'm not sure what happened, exactly (I don't get TV), but yes we do have to make a distinction between terrorists and those that harbor them. IF the person haboring had known, then yes of course they can be charged with abetting a criminal. However, if they had not known (say if someone had taken flight lessons without stating their purposes except for "wanting to be a pilot"), then those people cannot be charged.

I don't think that most people my age really fully realize the magnitude of what has just happened. We laugh, make jokes because it's our way of coping. But if you can cope and realize it at the same time, than it's okay. However, making jokes and not realizing what happened could be a problem. I don't know if you've heard Marianne Williamson, but she said that, with respect to problems such as this, there are two ends of the spectrum: denying, or dwelling. Finding a middle ground is the best: Denying something isn't healthy; neither is dwelling. I agree with her...If my peers could just get to that point (hey, it's hard for me), I think things would be a lot better.

On a final note, today or tomorrow I'm going to head over to the banks and Red Cross and see if I can donate some money and blood to support the people in NYC and DC.

Thanks for creating a place for me to share my opinions.


Hail To My Fellow Wiccan, Pagan, & Witches: In Honor Of The Victims... Sep 12th. at 8:49:20 pm UTC

Elisa F. Nunez B.K.A. Gypsy Moon (North Bergen, New Jersey US) Age: 37 - Email


Hail to my fellow Wiccan, Pagan, & Witches:
In honor of the victims of the World Trade Center disaster, everyone will be putting American flags in front of our houses as well as our cars in support of our country, for the victims as well as our falling heroes. Please pass this on to families and friends. Thank you and God Bless America!


Even Through The Numbness That Engulfed Me On Tuesday And The Grief... Sep 12th. at 8:31:07 pm UTC

Gwydion Graywolf (Indianapolis, Indiana US) Age: 31


Even through the numbness that engulfed me on Tuesday and the grief that reading the posts here finally unlocked and allowed to vent, I have seen a major flaw in the perception of these terrible acts. The news media and many politicians keep calling these terrorist attacks an act of war. They are NOT! The terrorist acts of Tuesday, Sept. 11th were nothing more than CRIMINAL acts of mass murder. To call them acts of war is to rank these criminals with those legitimate soldiers and true warriors of the world and thus denigrates those who dedicate their strength to the cause of defense and protection. Anyone connected to these attrocities should be treated like the criminals that they are and be captured, tried and imprisoned for those crimes. (Preferably in a New York area prison. After a few days in the general population, they'll wish they were dead.)In any case, I believe the Lord and Lady will bring the cosmic scales into balance once again.

The Wheel still turns and the shock of these tragedies has brought home to me the sheer preciousness of life via the example of how quickly it can be taken. Most of my life has been lived with the confidence of the belief that there will always be tomorrow. Today the numbness of shock has passed and the grief and rage has lessened with my giving vent to my emotions. (Not an easy thing for an American male raised to believe in the value of being stoic and not giving vent to emotions, especially grief.) I am left with a feeling of restlessness. When I'm finished typing this post, I'll give vent to that restlessness to power the changes I've long desired for my life but have been constantly putting off for another day.

Lastly, I would like to offer my advise for the days ahead. All of us need to work even more to temper our intuition and sensitivity to danger as such sensitivity will help to keep one out of harm's way. These past few days, I've heard many stories of people who listened to that inner voice and thus escaped danger. Then we need to draw on the confidence that such sensitivity can bring and leave behind unnecessary fear. If we cower in fear in the wake of this tragedy then the bastards win. By all means, grieve as you need but don't let fear lock you away from the joy of life. Show the terrorists that we will not be ruled by fear. Laugh in their faces, and, to paraphrase Monty Python, clear your nasal passages at them and fart in their general direction.

Live, love, work magicks to strengthen the Light and trust that as long as the Wheel still turns the Lord and Lady will see that scales are balanced in the end.

Light, Love and Bright Blessings to all!


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