The opinions posted on the Pagan Perspective pages are those of individuals and are not neccessarily shared or endorsed by the Witches' Voice inc.
Posted: Nov. 17, 2002
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Question of the Week: 14 - 11/6/2000
The Unresolved US Election
Did YOU vote? Which candidate did you vote for? How do you feel about the political wrangling going on right now in Florida? Will/Should either candidate concede for the good of the country-or should either/both fight it out until we all scream for mercy? How do you think either candidate, if declared the winner, will be able to bring the country together given the inference that the election results now point to an America that is almost equally divided into one camp or the other? And the BIG question-What, if any, impact will the final results have on the Pagan communities?
| Reponses: There are 263 responses posted to this question.
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| I Voted For Gore. I Don't Believe Gore Is The "perfect Candidate... ||Nov 12th. at 12:04:55 pm UTC|
|SpiritFlame (Phila, Pennsylvania US) ||Age: 28 |
I voted for Gore. I don't believe Gore is the "perfect candidate" but I believe he is much better than Bush. I don't trust Bush. Anyone who talks about how "my daddy didn't get me here" probably got there on his father's coattails. Also, it makes me very nervous that the NRA and the religious right support him. And as much as I consider myself pro-life, since I don't trust Bush, I don't want him deciding not only on abortion, but also possibly on birth control, fertility, and other areas of a woman's life that the president has no business being involved in.
Echoing some other comments in this section -- I really detest that Bush feels that Wicca is not a true religion. It's true to me! It is a huge part of my life! Jesus Christ is not a part of my life -- does that mean that Christianity is not a true religion because I don't believe in it? I think Bush should leave the business of judging the validity of religions to the Goddess (or, in his case, God). If he becomes president, will we as Wiccans lose our freedom of religion because of one man's opinions? I think there is a lot at stake here.
It seems to me the entire system of election is falling apart. First Florida, now four or five other states are considering recounts, and there's talk of lawsuits to have a new vote, there's talk of fraud by brother Jeb -- just a huge, huge mess. I wonder what other nations are thinking of us right now? Probably laughing their behinds off.
On the one hand, I want this finished, and I want the endless media analysis to stop (they're going in circles). On the other hand, I really, REALLY want Gore to win because he is for middle class families and religious freedom, and I'm thinking that, maybe, if they count long enough, he'll turn out to be the winner.... Have we really come a long enough way in history that one man wouldn't bring us back to the witch hunts (modern day version of banning things and censorship, of course)?
| I Voted For Nader. My S.o. Voted For Browne. I Don't Care... ||Nov 12th. at 10:17:42 am UTC|
|sabine (Milwaukee, Wisconsin US) ||Age: 39 |
I voted for Nader. My S.O. voted for Browne. I don't care for either of the main candidates, and I'd like to see more choices than the two-party system affords. However, I'd rather see Gore win than Bush.
| I Voted For Gore. Both Candidates Will Face Incredible Opposition From All... ||Nov 12th. at 9:30:46 am UTC|
|Mino (Naples, Florida US) ||Age: 42 - Email |
I voted for Gore. Both candidates will face incredible opposition from all the hoop-la that the close election has brought to this country. This will promote further distrust between republicans and democrats.
IMHO, pagan communities will continue to gel and swell under any presidency. Human planetary 'good-citizenship' would be served best under Gore. Bush would allow more destruction of the environment necessary to maintain the human existence. Nobody really knows what a president can accomplish from his political platform due to opposition in congress and senatorial debate.
The big question is: What power does an individual have in this country? The Electorial College IS an important consideration in a presidential election. It represents the governmental concerns of large populations in geographical areas.
It is more of a socialist approach however, and should not overrule the Popular Vote, which is democracy in its purest form.
I think that a presidential candidate should be required to carry BOTH the Electoral College AND the Popular Vote. If there is a split, then there should be a run-off election between the two candidates, by Popular Vote. The American People would then decide the outcome, instead of the American Political Process.
This election being so close REQUIRES that votes be recounted in all areas of the country where the margin of victory was less than 5% ! Fair is fair.
| I Voted For The Rede In The Form Of The Libertarian Platform... ||Nov 12th. at 3:02:07 am UTC|
|Trickster (Austin (belly of the beast), Texas US) ||Age: 42 - Email |
I voted for the Rede in the form of the Libertarian platform. And tho there is no clear winner between Gush and Bore, I feel we are all losers as far as president goes. Neither seems to have the words "freedom" or "liberty" in their vocabularies. Their idea of smaller government is to limit how much it will grow. I do feel, however, that we did win one battle. The Green party failed to achieve their goal of 5% and thus does not qualify for federal matching funds next time. I'm tired of involuntarily financing two campaigns which I do not support, and the idea of paying for a third totally disgusts me. Especially when I freely contribute to the party of my choice which will never take tax dollar one to hype their candidate. As for Florida...
Lemme tell ya story 'bout a man named Jeb
counted up the votes and he told a little fib
folks picked Buchannan when they really wanted gore
misplaced some ballots and they threw away some more
foiled that is
Well the first thing ya know Al Gore is screamin' "foul!"
he said "Hell no! I won't throw in the towel!"
folks said "DC is the place you oughta be!"
so he loaded up the lawyers and lit out from Tennessee
shills, that is
I wish that we could say goodbye to Jeb and all his kin
cause citizens are losers all, no matter which one wins
but they'll be comin' back next week with lawyers and daddy
we'll get a heapin' bellyful of the George Bush family
ballots count off
wait a spell
y'all get no Slack now, ya hear?
(the Florida Bushbillies by Trickster & Moonowl)
| I Did Vote And I Am Pretty Disgusted With The Way Florida... ||Nov 12th. at 1:37:59 am UTC|
|Bethany (Phoenix, Arizona US) ||Age: 39 |
I did vote and I am pretty disgusted with the way Florida handled the election process in the first place. They definitely made the ballot confusing and when they found people voting for two candidates or for a disproportionate amount for Buchanan they just threw the double ballots out and did not question it. You know this is the Year of the Dragon and the year of extremes. The ongoing election fraud and mishandling of ballots was eventually going to come to a head. We are probably just touching the tip of the iceberg of what has gone on for years, and now that we are in the "information age" we are more informed on the questions we are facing on the election. I dont think anyone should concede because we are already have a President until January. But we do need to get a handle on this situation whether it be decided federally or by a judge. I shake at the thought that we as country elected someone so alien to the environment as George W., I shudder to think if he appoints Justices to the Supreme Court that reverse all the gains we have made especially in women's right to chose. You I saw a program that said that George W. was a "C" student and he got through Yale and a business college with a "C" average and now he will President and being responsible for rather complex decisions and diplomacy in the new millenium which by the way comes in 2001. Thank for allowing me to voice my opinion as I live in a relatively conservative state and much of the people SURROUNDING me are Republicans.
| I Did Not Vote . Simply Because I Do Not Believe In Either... ||Nov 12th. at 1:04:36 am UTC|
|shannon (mesa, Arizona US) ||Age: 23 - Email |
i did not vote . simply because i do not believe in either one of the men running. but i do believe that gore should stop being such a sore loser and let it go allready .
| Solve This And As Quickly As Possible! I Believe That Any And... ||Nov 12th. at 12:19:19 am UTC|
|Democrat-4-Life Eli (Fort Lauderdale, Florida US) ||Age: 18 |
SOLVE THIS AND AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE! I believe that any and all legal actions to preserve the integrity of the system should be carried through to conclusion and that until that neither men should step down, but this has absolutely got to be rectified before people in other nations suddenly decide that since their votes in America might not matter anymore than their votes or (if they don't have a vote) their opinions in their own nations. People come here in large part because we choose our leaders, and if any doubt of that exists nations around this world will have a damaged image of our nation. Please resolve this as thoroughly as necessary but as quickly as possible, and then find a way to spin this in our favor internationally, say for instance because we've gone through all this and there are no riots or tanks and soldiers in the streets, and in fact it has served to rekindle the spirit of grass-roots action that helped to make the 1960s a tossup for the proudest time in our history (the tossup being between then and now, now that we have the strongest economy in our nation's history). No excuses, but no mistakes either, just get it done.
| I Live In Broward County, And Although I Checked Over My Punches... ||Nov 12th. at 12:06:45 am UTC|
|Eli (Fort Lauderdale, Florida US) ||Age: 18 |
I live in Broward County, and although I checked over my punches in my ballot and I believe I checked the back to make sure the holes were perfect, in the event that MY vote for Al Gore was somehow misread by a machine I would like them to do as thorough a recount as necessary to be within 98% accuracy. I can also tell you that two points of Florida election law were violated by the Palm Beach, one saying that the hole must be placed to the "right" of the candidate's name, the other specifying very specifically that the top parties, Republican and Democrat, shall be placed at the top two points and nobody else above or in between them, and there is also in the laws a picture of what a ballot must look like and the Palm Beach ballot did not conform. The law is the law. As for the Bush camp's Federal suit, machine counts are considerably less reliable than hand counts, so the hand count does need to be done to check these thousands and thousands of ballots where the machines could find no punches for the Presidential candidate. Governor George W. Bush himself signed a law in Texas agreeing with what I said, that in close races hand counts are preferable, and contrary to what Karen Hughes has said machine counts are not used for reliability but rather speed, since so many elections yield clear winners regardless of the tiny errors. Another factor is that because of thousands upon thousands of instances of black and elederly voter intimidation, civil rights protection groups from all around the country may soon be mounting one of the largest single civil rights battles ever foughts. If the Bush camp can find similar instances in which the law provides for a legal challenge and sufficient evidence exists to consider rectifying problems with the election system, I invite them. I voted for Al Gore, I voted the straight Democratic ticket, and I quite frankly despise the Republican Party and would like to see it's immediate disbandment, but what matters to me more than party conflicts is the integrity of what it supposed to be an unimpeachable election process in which the votes of each person matter, and intelligence or thoroughness are not factors in your ability to properly cast a vote (I know that can never be entirely guaranteed, but it should be 99% guaranteed that even a retarded individual with an IQ of say 65-70 can figure out the ballot with a little help), and certainly hanging pieces of paper and mechanical errors and illegal ballots and ballot designs that confuse and mislead voters should never be a factor in any election. If Bush legitimately won this election I will absolutely accept that and hold my political nose for the next four years, but each and every voter in this nation must have their rights protected, regardless of who they voted for or where they voted, and regardless of whether it's a Presidential election, a Senate election, a Gubernatorial election, or a City Council election, that is what is guaranteed by our Constitution, read it if you want and you'll see that nowhere does it say anything about an acceptable margin of error in the election system, and so I would say that the margin should be vastly less than 1% margin for error, because expecting anything better than vastly less than a 1% margin for error, and I mean nationally, would be expecting reality to turn itself upside-down, nothing anywhere, even 2+2=4, has a completely 100% guarantee, just vastly vastly more than 99% at best. In short, all litigation should be welcome, the world should not see the US setting the example of allowing a gigantic margin for voting error.
| If I Was Old Enough 2 Vote...i Would've Voted For Anyone... ||Nov 11th. at 11:50:59 pm UTC|
|Moonlight Myst (Sequim, Washington US) ||Age: 14 - Email |
If I was old enough 2 vote...I would've voted for anyone but Bush. I feel a bit angered at the fact that he doesn't believe that Wicca is a true religion. The U.S. is a free country & we should be able to choose (or not choose) whichever religion that we please. To me it seems that Bush should think before he speaks...perhaps he should've read about it before he judged my religion. I didn't hide my thoughts about the election whenever someone asked, and I also gave them the same reason I'm giving now. In conclusion, If Bush happens 2 win, I hope all the pagans who voted Bush know that they gave away their freedom of religion.
| I Just Couldn't Vote For A Corporate Candidate - Nader, After Much Thought... ||Nov 11th. at 11:46:27 pm UTC|
|John Slade (St. Paul, Minnesota US) ||Age: 34 - Email |
I just couldn't vote for a corporate candidate - Nader, after much thought.
That thought mostly tended to 'why have the Clintons and the Gores sold the soul
of the Democratic party'? I know that Bush stands for 95% of the things I disagree with, but Gore stands for 65% of the things I disagree with, and that 65% of bad outweighs the 30% of good for me.
The ballot stuff? I think it's a good object lesson that shows people how those in power will act. Scrabbling.
Another part of me thinks it's bad, because it will make people cynical.
I disagree with the Bush camp's attempt to stop the hand count.
I think the Bush folks were lying about the Buchanan vote. I think that Jeb Bush is using what power he can to get George into power.
I don't know what the best thing to do is; I'm interested in the results of a hand count. We will survive for another couple weeks like this.
America nearly divided? Yeah -- into those who vote and those who don't. Turnout was up -- up to about 52% of the electorate, minus kids, minus those declared insane, minus those declared felons by our insane war on drugs. Those who bother are also divided.
In the Pagan community, I see the biggest result being fighting over whether the Green Party's candidacy was a good thing or not, particularly from Gore supporters. I also see a step forward in Real Left organization, and a possible step backwards under a Republican administration. Which will be rather hamstrung on social issues, but have free rein on corporate issues.
| I Have To Say That The Choices This Time Did Not Seem... ||Nov 11th. at 11:25:54 pm UTC|
|L.stringfellow (Phoenix, Arizona US) ||Age: 33 |
I have to say that the choices this time did not seem to be very appealing. Unfortunately, I did not vote this time around; I have recently become an Arizona resident (after being a Florida resident for many years!).
I've been somewhat dismayed by this year's presidential election.
Of course, in good faith, I could never vote for "W" Bush. Another responder stated that "Bush scares me." Well, I pretty much concur with that statement.
Not only are his politics counter to what I believe, but the man is constantly misspeaking! On the other hand, Gore may "stand for" what I believe in: women's rights, personal freedom, the environment, etc. However, I have to say that I just don't trust the guy. When I look at him, I have to say that I'm not sure he will actually uphold the promises he makes while in office. Perhaps that's my mistrust of politicians, in which case, if Gore does become President and he does uphold his statements, I will have to admit I'm wrong about him in four years. (!) Well, I honestly hope that Gore does win the election (not Bush!), and that I do have to admit I'm wrong in four years.
As a former resident of Florida, I have to say that this entire fiasco does not surprise me in the least. However, I do think that's it's only right that they do the vote recount at this point. The thing that is surprising to me is that, in Florida, every registered voter is sent a sample ballet. So, I'm not sure why these people, who claim to have been tricked, are so confused. I imagine, granted, that many people don't look at the ballots, and a few elderly people may become confused by them, but I'm not sure I buy the premise that they "didn't know what they were doing." The "elderly" are not that inept.
Whatever the case, the entire scenario is ridiculous. It's interesting, but ridiculous.
As of late, Bush has been putting the pressure on to halt the vote recount in Florida. There is a law suit in the works, apparently (or so the story goes).
The fact that he is trying to stop the recount says something to me about his character--if he were interesting in honestly determining what the actual count is, he would allow the recount to be done without question. The fact that he is trying to impede this process says, "O.K., we should abide by the rules, except when it comes to ME...". Sorry, I think the guy's a hypocrite.
| Yes, I Voted For Al Gore. I Consider Myself A "yellow Dog... ||Nov 11th. at 10:39:58 pm UTC|
|Thepdaq (Austin, Texas US) ||Age: 45 - Email |
Yes, I voted for Al Gore. I consider myself a "Yellow Dog" Democrat and always vote so that others may have a "choice" on whom to vote. Bush is the "anti-christ" for Pagans and "free thinkers" alike, not to mention being a "daddy's boy" putting "daddy's office" back in power. Any pagan that voted for Bush just voted to throw out their rights to be and think different from the radical christian rightwing.
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