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The Witches' Voice made the decision from day one to evolve this web site based on your input. What does our community think about... Spam, ethics, commercialism of the Craft, politics etc. So many questions are hotly debated. In this chapter of WitchVox we simply ask hard questions directly to the community itself. New surveys will pop up from time to time and be announced on the WitchVox home page.
 Author: Pagan Community    Posted: Sep. 27, 1999   This Page Viewed: 11,974  


WitchVox Survey #1 - Working with Groups

  • Participate IN this Survey - Click HERE for TAKE this Survey
  • 1st Duration: 9/12/99 to 9/27/99
  • 1st Results: Posted on 9/27/99 - Click HERE for the actual results of this survey.
  • 2nd Duration: Through Samhain 2000
  • Community thoughts on working with Groups... ONE - TWO - THREE - FOUR - FIVE - SIX


Community Comments on Working With Groups
Page #3



My work has been done alone. I never have been a fan of any organised religion, including wiccan. My guide is my intuition. I use many resources and then sort through for what "feels right" for the time. I do enjoy sharing ideas with others. As I heal myself I can heal others as it is meant to be! Blessed Be! - Becky



Actually, I don't have a really defined magickal path, mainly because I don't really do much magick; not that I don't like to, I just don't know what I'm doing. I'm solitary, but not by choice. I have realized that I'm not really cut out for doing it all on my own, but because I have moved around a few times in these two years that I've been Pagan, and because I have a real shyness problem, I haven't had much of a chance to get with a group or a mentor. I'm currently working on it, but I frequetly feel that nothing's going to change. - Eric Schwenke



Both can work,and I think experiencing both are absolutely necessary to understanding particularly Wicca. The experience of being alone with the gods is very different from the experience of channeling energy in a group, and such practice does enrich a person's viewpoint. - Diana Rajchel Olsen



As a solitary I find the need to work at times. I have felt the desirt ti enter a group however as I look I find I feel strange about it. I attended several get aquainted open forums but they did not feel right. It felt if I could do it as well or better. I feel funny watching someone else find an inner connection when I have trouble letting go. And never accidently e-mail the priestess by her other name asking for information about the group to question the focus or etical leaning of the leadership. Seemed like a bad move oh well. - Dillon



I work as a solitaire because I am not comfortable working with many of the pagans in my area. I am not adverse to working with a group, I just have not found one that I feel I can work with. - Owlie



My rising sign is Aquarius, so I really am not well suited to solitary practice. I was graciously accepted into the Witches of the Woods coven (listed on WV as S.P.I.R.A.L.) in Nashville, Tennessee when I started on the path in 1994. My wife (whom I met in that coven) and I founded our own coven (Sleeping Dragon Circle) when we moved to Huntsville, Alabama, where there was family support for a nationwide job search. We now reside in the high desert of New Mexico and have connected with several covens. Right now it looks as if we will be joining forces with Circle of the Winter Moon (not listed on WV). I have found no experience more satisfying than group ritual with people of diverse talents. When you have empaths, a clairvoyant, a clairaudiant and other powerful energy workers focusing their will and talents within sacred space anything can (and does!) happen. My life is richer for these moments which lift the veil to reveal unseen worlds I always hoped (and knew) were there. I feel sorry for those afraid to take that step into the unknown. They live in denial of their own power and the majick that is only the beginning of our rediscovery of Who We Really Are. Blessed be. - Lance Reid



I wouldnt mind working with a group of alot of people like in a public circle but lately i have been thinking about joining a coven - Oborot Shadow Walker



I pratice in groups when I can, but being under-age, I rarely have the chance... I wish you had a place on Witchvox that could be a teen events page... so that I would know if there was anything in my aira... - Jessica/Camille Thomas



Wish that you had a different set up for this survey. We have four of us that use the same internet account, all of us want to participate in the survey. Dandelion is not just a circle, we are a family and community. While all of us work solitary occasionally, We come together to circle and learn together. -



I consider myself primarily a Witch, as a priestess of the Blue Star Wiccan tradition & a founder member of the Vingolf Asatru Fellowship who practises magic both as a solitary & as a covener. For me, worshipping with a group on a regular basis requires a certain level of comfort with other members, but working magic with a group on any deep level requires a deeper intimacy. I have been extremely lucky to be a founder member of a coven in which I may expose my deepest vulnerabilities without fear. I have, however, heard horror stories; some of unintended harm through plain lack of consideration, & others of deliberate & calculating manipulation. I am aware that there are as many flakes in the Pagan community as in any other, but there are greater numbers of honest, decent people. I remain optimistic about our community, if only because for every horror story I hear, I know of many more contented Pagans whose lives are enriched by their solitary or group based worship. We are, I believe, growing up, & learning how to be real Pagans in the real world. - Raven



Most of my experience has been solitare, not group. I still work solitary occaisionally. Different groups have different dynamics, so it is difficult to make a comparison. -



I find it more satisfying to work with a group. However, I also feel that one must maintain a private link to the Divine as well. A great deal is learned by doing, and feeling free to make mistakes. I think that solitary work is good for that. - Jenna



I'm 19 years old and have had an interest in Pagan and "New Age" things for as long as I can remember, but was never aware that there was actually a large community and a religion out there until only a few years ago. I got the classic "coming home" feeling and have since been studying independently to figure out what I believe, what I agree with, and how I'll go about my individual practice. When I came to college, I met a very small group of others who shared my interests. (the school is small to begin with) For the most part, the others are also still struggling, only recently liberated from the religions they were brought up in, so most of the responsibility for arranging meetings, and helping lead discussions is put on one leader who is a senior now, has actively practiced for several years, and also has a car, which is pretty significant in college! Though our meetings have had low attendance and are very unorganized, and end up just becoming campfire talks instead of full-fledged rituals, my experience with the group has been very positive. Our group leader has been nothing but constructive in simply helping us get together and get a chance to talk about what we believe. I'm looking forward to joining more experienced and active groups when I'm older and out of school, but for now, just getting to socialize with others heading on the same general direction as me has been a good initial step. - MaryJo Wood



I am working solitaire for now until my training is complete. I feel once I am familiar enough with the craft, I may join a coven. I am currently taking correspondence training via E-mail. I feel solitary work is very relaxing and satisfying and I can only hope that group work has the same outcome. - Erin Ryder



I have only recently started practicing witchcraft and still have a lot to learn. I have only ever worked by myself and I find it satisfying but I also think that if I joined a group it would centre my concentration better. - Emily Shrapnel



I find working with a group satisfying because I believe community is an important aspect to religious life. I also have a strong sense of spirituality that may or may not mesh with other members of my fellowship. I have found the consensus model the most useful for a group. Also one has to balance between being to expansionist in a group (and losing that personal cohesiveness) and being isolationist (and becoming too "clannish"). - Tom Murphy



I work on both levels. As a member of a group, we gather for full moons, holidays and discussions. I find that there is a different energy that is raised and rituals tend to encumpass more. Group ritual has too take into consideration everyones needs. Where working as a solitaire, I can focus more on a specific matter. The group I gather with gets together for fullmoons, holidays and discussions. The rituals are always stuctured in a pagan/wiccan manner. Creating a circle, drawing the quarters and so on. When I do solitary work I can use whatever stucture stikes me at the time. Usually sigil magick, sometime wiccan or meditative. Either way has its merits. - Carl



I feel most comfortable working as a Solitaire, not that I wouldn't try a group someday. I think personal intuition, introspection into what you believe, and communing with nature in private ways and choosing to be as Eclectic as one prefers, are definitely perks for one with solitary practice. Ritual is very personal to me, and you don't have to worry if someone else thinks you're silly, or not doing it right, if you're working with just you and the Gods. It really depends if you're shy or not, too. Though, I feel that all and everyone is connected in the universe. - Anck-su-namun



I used to be solitaire for most of my begining time studying. I have gone through the horriable experiance of a nasty coven breakup but am now a member of a coven that has shown me how great it is to learn and study with others rather than having to struggle through in the dark on your own. - Diana



I have never been a part of an organized coven or group. My grandmoter was a solitary and taught me I have spent most of my life trying to study all religions. I am an ordained Metapsyical minister . I always come back to the basic concept of wiccian belief .I taught my children to respect the mother and to make up thier own minds about what to believe and to always keep an open mind. I met the man I just Married when he was about 15 he went to school with my daughter he would call me to ask questions about wicca, pagens and other alternative beliefs. after a number of years as his info guide and the parting of ways over amoung oter things my spritual beliefs with my ex husband .we found each other and as he was over 18 I took him on as a student and our relationship grew from the shared experience of our spritual beliefs we have a very strong connection to the mother and that makes a very strong bond between us. so it is usually just the two of us working together sometimes we ask for support from my daughter and her friends in texas. the internet has made a big difference we do not feel so issolatted any more, we would be interrested in working with a group so we can learn more. blessed be Rev. Stratton - Rev. Jill Stratton



I am happy with being a solitairy, but I would like to join a group if I found one I was comfortable with. -



Having experienced a good coven relationship, I would welcome it again should the opportunity arise. Until then I stay in touch with community by participating in open public rituals several times a year. (I live in a remote location.) My search for a compatible coven taught me that finding the right blend of personalities required is a rare thing. I also greatly desire to find that one special person to be my "working partner" and spouse - I suspect such a partnership could enhance our spirituality and relationship greatly. - Graybear



With regards to Q1 of WwG, I work both as a Solitaire (my own personal stuff and cycles, am currently keeping the Esbat Cycle) and with a fellow priestess (we're keeping a Sabbat Cycle that began at Ostara and is due to end Imbolg of 2000. Plus the two of us are negociating with two of our close friends (one male, one female), who had been members of the first coven I had ever taken part in, about the strong possibility of reforming a four-person coven to keep the Sabbat Cycle starting Samhain of 1999. It might be nice to include that shadowy category of people who do both as a possible response. As to Q2 of WwG, with some notable exceptions, I find public rituals off the topic of the Sabbats, Esbats and worship. Mind you, they can be fun and entertaining. Briefly, they tend to be high on the mirth and low on the reverence (as in: "And therefore let there be [...] mirth and reverence within you". -The Charge of the Goddess by Doreen Valiente- may the Lord and the Lady welcome her to the Summerland. Don't get me wrong, I am fully aware that they meet the needs of lots of people, it's just that I tend to like/need/require a "deeper" format (yes I trance/space out quite easily) which isn't possible at a public ritual or festival ritual. Primary reasons for this are that these days, everyone is tippytoeing around any controversial content in public festival rituals. In other words, they're doing things like having 8 or 9 different traditions do a ritual together as happened at Kaleidescope (SW of Ottawa) this year at Lammas. Cool. Helps to foster understanding between the various paths of Wicca/NeoPaganism/Druidry/Shamanism/Ceremonial Magick and so forth. Unfortunately, what happens is that the depth and richness of each path are diminished (after all, they are editing the paths to conform to a "showcase" format) and the result, in my opinion, is a reduced religious value. Assuming that if what you mean by religious value is that tremendous feeling you get when you feel at One with the Divine (after all, the Latin root for Religion is "religare" or "to link"). The various frequencies of the energies used/accessed do not necessarily mesh and one could argue that they sometimes interfere with each other. Furthermore, different symbol sets weaken the group mind (even if that Group Mind exists only for the duration of one Public Circle). For example if half the people in a Circle attribute Air as East and Athame/Sword whereas the other half attribute Air as South and Wand then they are working against each other in their visualizations and the result is more muddled. On a related note, maybe I'm neurotic (OK, I probably am), but I have some reservations about Circling with an untested batch of strangers. I may only be a 21 year old male, but my relatively short life has taught me that although it's alright to give people the benefit of the doubt when you first meet them, it's also good practice to watch them closely until you better ascertain their motives and character. Using the analogy of the GLBT community, a significant proportion of them are screwed up - the result of poverty, various forms of trauma & abuse, ostracism, guilt, deceitful and angry. Likewise, a significant proportion of the pagan community are screwed up. That's what draws a lot of people to Wicca and related paths: the possibility of making oneself whole and the benefit of a symbol set (Descent of the Goddess, shadow work of the Second Degree, intuition, dreamwork and so forth) that helps to meet, understand, accept and resolve one's issues and problems. Basically, Witches/Pagans/Druids and related occultists are like everyone else in that we are human. We have the potential to do wrong and right. Some people we meet at public rituals/festivals are wonderful, kind and mature. Others aren't, one can only avoid those and pray that they manage to heal themselves without hurting too many people. After all: "... if that which you seek you find not within you, then you will never find it without you. For behold, I have been with you from the beginning: and I am that which is attained at the end of desire." -D.Valiente I guess it's pagan PR that forces us to cast the witch/pagan/wiccan as only good. Unfortunately, this sets a misleading impression for new comers. Compare with the disillusionment a young GLBT person may feel after coming to terms with the realities lurking behind Pride Parades. Yes, the archetype of the wise benevolent witch is a good goal to aspire to. It is necessary to counter aeons of negative brainwashing. But it might be prudent to note that our capability to do right is equal to our capability to do wrong. Even in a pagan frame of mind which sees right and wrong as case sensitive and relative in any case. Mayhaps we should admit to ourselves (at least) that witches are neither good nor bad, they are human like anyone else. To return to the topic: the nice part of covens is that you can screen out people who aren't going to be productive members of the group mind. The best part about solo work is that you're likely to get your strongest connection/link to your God/desses this way. I've heard it said that your solo work is the most important bit of the religious flavour of Craft as opposed to magickal Craft (using magick to make one's life better) or political/feminist Craft (furthering the advances of the Divine Feminine and womynkind) or Festival Craft (just partying I guess). The great part about public/festival rituals is that you get to meet a lot of people and are exposed to different methods and traditions- just don't forget to clean your aura/chakras afterwards. Snarky to a certain degree, yes. But hey, I'm just a kitten (3 years since I dedicated myself to this path, dozens of books read and about a year of intense training with a fairly traditionnal teacher yet at the same time heavily influenced by feminist and queer friends) and am certainly entitled to my opinions, however strange they may be. And yes, I am very well aware that my views are in the minority. Blessed be! - greycat@magma.ca



I have found working with groups to be either too "New Age Christian" oriented, or else very dogmatic and controlling in the power-over sense. I prefer to work with my husband and family members such as my sister and daughter. - Sacha Chevalier



I find my path challenging. I would love to meet others and work in a group, but both travel and just a little bit of fear stop me. In the whole, I find nothing more satisfing than my worship. It is the only thing that has given my life meaning in a long time. - J. Moore



I have worked alone and in small groups of other solitary practitioners of varying paths and experience levels.Both have proved to be satisfying and educational; I learned not only about other paths, but about myself and my path as well. In my journey, I have come to believe that I am Preistess, I am Teacher, and, most importantly if I am to grow, I am Student. - Shar'Eth



I have felt that working within a group environment is much more fulfiling than being a solitaire, but because of my age (i'm 17), joining a group or coven on a permenant basis causes a lot of legal issues and age problems. When I do turn 18 though, I fully intend to find a group because I enjoy the dynamics and working with other people - it's just nice to have someone else to bounce ideas off of or be able to ask "hey did you feel that too?" - Brandon C.



Our coven was formed from a group of solitaries who were working on a play together. We eased into ritual (at first monthly, quickly becoming weekly). We started out as women-only, but our men tagged along for the drumming and feast. One by one, they also joined the group. We accepted new members for quite a while (and still do, periodically) and evolved into a mixed-gender Dianic coven. Not all the members are Dianic (or even Wiccan) but our rituals are always Dianic. We've been together now for seven years (I think) and have hived off twice. We are often invited to other people's rituals and we sometimes attend gatherings as a group and have usually been dissatisfied with those rituals. We sometimes get the feeling that people aren't serious about connecting with Deity and sometimes the ritual form itself is too hierarchical for our tastes. We appreciate the beauty of new rituals but all of us prefer to connect with Deity one-on-one without a priestly intermediary. We all have our own solitary work that we continue as daily practice. We feel that makes us more powerful and centered when we come together. So I guess I should say we are a group of solitaries and that seems to work pretty well! Be blessed! -



I do not follow any one tradition or path, although I have been described as basically a "Witch" and to other "Wiccan". I am spiritually androgynous and therfore I remain physically as well, I only stated that I was Male, as that is the more physically obvious and that I needed to in order to submit this survey. The Goddess and the God have given us individual minds, free will and free thought. I do what I feel is right, when I feel it is right. I use my knowledge of the Earth and her many plants, for the purpose of healing, protection, ritual, and prayers only. - DarHalen



For myself working alone is the best option at this point on my path as I am not quite "out" except to a few very close friend, my children and my wife. Unfortunately in my primary occupation I am surrounded by what could be graceously called "intolerant fundie" so very few of my friend at work know of my beliefs and the few that do understand my reluctance to express my views. Maybe some day i'll be drawn to a grou[p or coven, when that time comes if it does, I'll go from there. - Athelwolfe



For now I am staying solitare. The Witch Wars in this City are still raging. So for now it is just a matter of hanging back and waiting till the dust settles. It quite amazes me that such a large city can have so little to offer the comunity. I have corresponded with, and talked directly with other pagans from out of state. Finding the papan climate in Florida for example is quite diffrent than were I am presently located. - Rev Owle aka Brian Johnson



Im not a true sole Practioner...We are a family who came into Wicca together...my husband and I(first) and we have decided to raise our three children on the pagan path. Some of the questions didnt really apply - Dana



I have been initiated into a coven and it wasn't until afterwards that I had found the actual path I was looking, unfortunately with some groups they don't let their students know what other options are out there. I study within a circle but only have one person who studies the Celtic Reconstructionism with me, we work with another woman who combines Wicca and Celtic Reconstructionism and I find this much more satisfying than being with the group I was initiated into. I think the satisfaction whether you are solitary or group working comes from feeling that "THIS" is right and you are "HOME". -



I've been a solitaire for the past year and have tried to join a number of covens in my area. But, they are to private to let anyone in. They even have posted on your website that they are looking for members. All I have ever wanted was to have someone teach me in person the ways. I know this is not your problem and not what you wanted to hear in the comments area of this servey, but I feel that this may have happened to others too and it is unjust to exclude people outside your own circle. Thank you for your time in reading this. Blessed Be - Kyle Wright



Solitaire can be very rewarding but time has taken its toll and the desire burns to pass the knowledge to all who are ready to seek not only the truth, but a better world. Finally living with the witch of my wildest dreams but she is just beginning, but oh what an intelligent student and learner. If only all my friends were as starved for the truth. I'm not quite as lonely anymore and I feel great things are coming our way. Blessed be to all the beautiful witches out there, male and female, who are spreading the truth on the winds. Hope to spend some time with a group some day. - Merlin,s Shadow



I am primarily a solitaire however I have a Lady whom I work with occaisionally who has instructed and guided me on this path. I think it would be interesting to participate in large rituals if only to be able to be part of a greater level of energy work. Bright Blessings - Macsen



I do enjoy working with groups but have noticed that when working with a previously untried group some rituals taken as normal for that group can be somewhat disturbing. I feel that anyone who is exploring groups needs to find out as much as possible about that group's activities before trying to work with them. This will lead to a better understanding and to better group cohesiveness. - Jason Lyle Jonte'



I have no "defined" title of what I do. I just deal with and worship the Divine Source in my own way. In the past I follow the native tradition, but got sickened by the egos,lies and contradictions,and the regulations put on women in the Lakota tradition. It did not have truth to it. - Melissa Morrison aka Artio Emryss



I am of no particular magickal path. I am still studying different ways and have not chosen which to follow. Meeting with others of like-minded beliefs is always welcomed. Keeping an open mind and faith is the main path to follow. - Tina Martinez



I've found private meditations to be much more comfortable and satisfying than group (or even solitary) ritual. - Celia SilverMoon



My situation is difficult to categorize as I an in an interfaith family. I am both Hindu and Wiccan. I am Hindu primarily but married to a Celtic Wiccan priest. I have cross trained in his tradition as well to priestess level. My husband is the reverse, being primarily Wiccan, secondarily Hindu. Some of the above questions were difficult to find an answer to as they are geared toward "modern Pagan" groups rather than old traditional ones. Hindus are Pagan but we do not work in coven or groves, etc. Our religion is family based and we have home rituals and attend temple services. I would almost need to fill out a seperate form to give information correctly! - Radha Fagan



This issue does not lend itself to a tidy questionair. I currently am a member of one group (wiccan), an ongoing visitor at another (dianic ecclectic) and also occasionally work alone. Oh, and I make it to about one Asatru Blot a year. This is really not tidy. -



I've recently found that being a newly dedicated witch where I live, it's hard to find pagan groups in the area. I feel that in this area (Toledo, Ohio) many of the pagan groups still feel the need to be in secret. - Stacy Liggett



I am a 5th generation witch. Although most of my Elder family members have past on, I am currently teaching my daughter, through the use of other Covens and Solidary practicioners the elements of Paganism & Wicca. I find it very useful to have the diversity of these people available to me to show my daughter the true meaning of our faith. - Raven Criss



It has taken us (my group) quite a long time to get our act together. We were all solitary at one point or another in our lives and are very aware of personal differences. It is possible that we have taken too much time and effort to get it "just right" but we believe that that is better than trying to simply throw the bunch of us together and hope for the best. - Lilith Silverhair



I worked solitaire for several years before helping to found a new group in San Diego. I must say, that although the solitaire work was definitely fulfilling, it does not begin to compare to the feeling of working with others of a like mind. - Will



The most important part of working alone or in a group is that you are comfortable in it. If you decide to work in a group, it has to be a group that you feel comfortable with, it has to match your goals and perceptions, and you have to have to be willing to contribute to the group. Too many covens - and feelings - have been hurt because a member joined without fully knowing why they really joined and what they could/should contribute to the Coven. - Chad A



At first I was solitary because I couldn't find a group. Then, I found one, but it just didn't "feel" right for me - not that they were Bad People (those came later), just not what I was looking for. So I went back to worshipping alone. Then, I got involved in a student group on the college campus, which underwent a huge upheaval and change in focus a few months after I joined up. The group's new direction didn't mesh with my needs, so off I went again. In the midst of that upheaval, an acquaintance invited me to his Hermetic circle a few miles away - curious about their practices, I agreed to go. Unfortunately, I was used by him without my knowledge, to test his group's policy of "visitors must be approved in advance". And there I was, wondering why everyone was glaring at me all night! After that experience, I swore off groups forever. I'm happier alone, just me and the Divine. I've done a few rituals with a small group of other people, but so far I still feel better working by myself. - lghc



I prefer solitary work not only because it is hard to find a coven in my area, but also because I believe that my work and what I wish to see done is a personal goal that only I have the power to accomplish. This is not to say that I do not accept help or that I turn a blind eye to those in need. I simply have no need for a group ritual, celebration, or magick. On occasion I will celebrate with a few of my friends, yet these celebrations are far from "traditional" ceremony. It is the traditional part of religion that I do not accept. Some argue that weakens or even undefines Witchcraft, but I feel comfortable with what I do. (I think I worte too much...) -



Solitary work is easier because you can tailor your work to your own needs, experience levels, schedules etc. The down side is not getting enough feedback and mentoring. Which is why I work with groups occassionally to get through blocks and find the next level. - Oakraven

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