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Page: Profile: Wren's Nest News Local
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Article: 19324
[Civil]
Date Posted:
1/28/2008
10:39:31 am EST
Wvox Stats
Views: 8,679
RSS: 14,285
Comments: 16
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Editorial: Devil Will Be In The Delivery In Bold Plan To Screen Kids
Author: New Zealand Herald Editorial Source: New Zealand Herald (NZ)
Title: EDITORIAL: DEVIL WILL BE IN THE DELIVERY IN BOLD PLAN TO SCREEN KIDS
You can't blame the Council for Civil Liberties for expressing reservations about the proposal to vet kids as young as 3 for anti-social behaviour. The council exists for the very worthwhile purpose of raising questions about the implications of public policy for individual rights. But the faintness of their response in this case makes it plain that they realise they are on a hiding to nothing.
The pronouncement by the council's chairman, Michael Bott, that "we may be encouraging a climate of fear where the state is looking into the private realm to find problems where there are none" will have fallen on very deaf ears indeed. Most of us know - or have known from time to time - what a climate of fear is. And what has accompanied such fear as we have felt has not been the thought that the state would intervene without reason but that it would intervene too late, too little or not at all.
Now a programme, developed by the Ministry of Education, working in conjunction with the Ministries of Health and Social Development, will screen kids aged between 3 and 7 for signs of anti-social behaviour which could identify whether they are likely to become future criminals.
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Community Thoughts: There are 16 comments posted | Reverse Sort |
| Skeptical | Jan 30th. at 2:26:23 pm EST
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Mysteries Child (Garfield, Arkansas) - Email Me
OK, I don't think any of us are, at this point, naive enough to believe that every family socializes its children with either their best interests or the greater good in mind.
There is a time and a place where someone-- be it the state, a volunteer mentor, or someone else-- has to step in and pick up the slack for those who do not have the psychosocial resources or the inclination to teach their children that, say, shooting the people who disagree with you and calling yourself an instrument of [God] is a bad idea.
However, I have very little faith in a government-run program-- *any* government-run program-- to accurately and efficiently identify the kids in need of help.
One, any government program is going to operate on the basis of what is best for the government. In the absense of some *very* strict and explicit guidelines as to what is to be considered 'antisocial,' this means that a lot of nontraditional ideals are going to be treated as pathological.
Two, quite a few people with some serious and dangerous social pathologies don't show symptoms that are going to attract attention. For example, I got on the nerves of my teachers and et cetera when I was at the healthiest point of my childhood mental illness curve-- ie, when I was willing and able to speak out about my situation and my point of view. When I was most on my way to becoming the next Tim McVeigh, I was doing it quietly, from behind The Wall, with little or no trouble to anyone.
Three, I wonder how they plan to deal with those they deem at-risk. Eleven years of consciously dealing with Asperger's syndrome has taught me, often painfully, that looking at someone, particularly a young someone, and saying, "Here, you're broken, we're going to fix you," is *not,* underline **not,** a recipe for success. What it is, is a recipe for building an individual who despises first themselves and then everyone and everything commonly deemed 'normal.'
I would have to hear more, much more, before I would want to pass judgment...
...but my initial gut response is to say that, were I in New Zeland, I'd be looking into homeschooling my kids, thinking, "This is probably a really, really bad idea."
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| Screening Children...... | Jan 30th. at 11:52:58 am EST
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Ardeith Carter (Zephyrhills, Florida) - Email Me
What a load of @#$##!!!!! Children are born anti- social!
They are not born knowing that sharing things is good, that hitting others is bad, that biting is a no-no, or that coloring inside the lines is what the teacher wants you to do.
They have to be taught these things, by their parents or other care-givers. Of course there will be many children between the ages of three and seven years old that appear to be anti-social, and possibly dangerous! Many of them actually are, until they learn from those around them that such behaviors will cause the grown-ups to apply disciplinary measures.
And if you don't think a three-year-old can be dangerous, just stand there and watch when such a tot goes into a tantrum and starts throwing things, and you catch a pretty little wooden block square in your eye!
It's up to the adults who are raising the child to apply whatever discipline is needed. It is NOT up to the state to determine these things . . . unless people give all such powers to the states.....
Ardeith Carter
Zephyrhills, Florida
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| Commentary | Jan 28th. at 9:00:22 pm EST
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NOVA (New Brunswick, New Jersey) - Email Me
Hooooo Boy, what next in merry ole England?
As if all those surveillance cameras weren't enough.
A few years back, they made a movie here in the US about this very subject, starring Tom Cruise.
Telling people their govt and police will 'profile' your kids, sounds chilling!
I wouldn't want to participate.
Such a label will follow the child throughout his/her life, likely causing them prejudice in school, colleges and lost employment too. THAT will cause economic strife which will 'surely' breed crime! Has anyone thought about that?!
It brings to mind an old 'Twilight Zone', about a society in which children were profiled in their youth, and those showing 'exceptional' skills were put to death, lest they disrupt the status quo of society. Shudder!
Frankly, this is nothing new, even here. School officials and teachers can put anything they like into a child's file, thus labeling them for life, and parents don't even realize it. Such labeling is very subjective and damaging, and should be illegal, or at the very least, disclosed to the parents and the child when they reach adulthood. But it is not.
Better it be a Service to society that there are programs available for any family who wants help.
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| And How Long Before... | Jan 28th. at 4:38:39 pm EST
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Paul the StormWalker (TUCKER!, Georgia) - Email Me
...things like religion or sexual orientation are part of the screening process to be be adjusted by the arms of the Mommy State? Before ideas like freedom and individualism and even self-expression are tell-tale signs for an "anti-social" attitude that must be adjusted away?
The thought of this kind of program under Bush or Huckabee makes me nauseas and afraid. The thought of a program like this under Hillary makes me want to buy guns and set up a fortified compound in Idaho.
If Hillary or Obama get into office, look for this program to be suggested by one of their appointees, probably the Surgeon General... and look for the unthinking Mommy State masses to hail it as a wonderful breakthrough... with nary a peep about the Constitution from anybody.
If reading your email looking for indications of terrorism are a Constitutional problem, then checking your children for the proper government approved thought patterns are much worse... unless you think the government is the solution to all social woes and should take care of you cradle to grave.
REMEMBER: It Takes a Village to Raise a Well Programmed, Docile, Government Approved Member of the Worker's Party of the Revolution for Change in America.
Paul the StormWalker
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| My Brotheres And I Would Have Been Locked Up | Jan 28th. at 4:05:10 pm EST
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Dennis Deal (Nazareth, Pennsylvania) - Email Me
My three younger brother and I would fight each other or any one that crossed us.
Yes we were little sob's and we made no bones about how we were willing to fight. I ran away from home formost of my teens.
The reason was simple. I wanted to be on my own already. Nothing more. By the time (I was 18 I was already living my own life.Had to stay in school till 19. But for the most part I bought my own clothes and fed myself.
My brothers all left home before 21 And were self sustaining adults. Our tendency to fight was lessend as we no longer had to deal with each other on such a 24 hour basis.
Had the this program been in our school they would have had us pegged as being antisocial lilsociopaths.
We were just four boys who had grown up together and were sick of looking at each other. Today we are all in our 40 with families and wives. Not one of us has a any prison time.
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| I Wish I Could Make Myself Think This Is . . . | Jan 28th. at 2:21:57 pm EST
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Shadowbear (Hillsboro, Oregon) - Email Me
a good idea. But, it is not. When I was a juvenile prosecutor it was well known to our group and to the probation officers who evaluated each child that we could tell some of the children who would become dangerous. Once, with a 9 year old, the probation officer recommended that he be locked up as long as we could for his current offense and then, when he came back, keep him locked up for as much of the rest of his life as possible. It is possible to indentify the psychopaths (or sociopaths or whatever they are being called today) as children. There is nothing to do about it though, except try to protect others from them as they grow up. These are the kids who start killing either pets or other children at a very early age just because they can or because they want to see what it looks like to drown. No conscience to develop. Very sad. This is a small group. The others can be worked with.
I do not want the government deciding who these children are because they will often be wrong and the process will (not might) be abused. Having a government agency deciding which children are to be "watched" as potential criminals or, when resources become much scarcer, "put down" because they cannot be made safe is just too dangerous. I would gladly have the Ted Bundys killing people in our society rather than have the government culling our children given the relative number of innocent victims that would be produced.
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| At Th Age Of 10 | Jan 28th. at 1:51:10 pm EST
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Lynette (Roanoke, Virginia) - Email Me
My daughter had the school shrink convinced she was so depressed that she was in danger of suicide. They were making emergency appointments for pyschaitrists and mental evaluations and had us all scared to death.
Fortunately, the doctor we found was someone my daughter liked. It turned out that she didn't like the school shrink and was spinning tales for her benefit. It only took 4 hours of therapy to get that bit of fantasy cleared up.
Of course, it cost me $800 in medical bills and a month of absolute terror that my child was going to kill herself if I took my eyes off her for 2 minutes.
NZ - be afraid, be very afraid....
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| Screening Kids? | Jan 28th. at 1:49:15 pm EST
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Jskelly (Ashland, Virginia) - Email Me
If this story were set in the US, I would be absolutely sure that the drug lobby was behind it. Get those kids on Ritalin, antidepressants, ect. as soon as they are weaned! Wonder how much power drug co.s have in other countries.
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| Assembly Line Psychology? | Jan 28th. at 1:32:33 pm EST
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bigcat (peoria, Illinois) - Email Me
I remember, one day when I chose a purple crayon to use as my sole color that day, the school Psychologist told my mom that she was worried that that could mean problems down the road.
I wondered if that couldn't just mean that I liked the color and nothing more, since I branched out later. I grew up to be as typical a kid as anyone could be back in the fifties and While I have made a few errors, I feel that I am a somewhat responsible adult.
I have always disliked cookie cutter interpretations and rationale. Such assumptions based on text and not life. A three year child is not old enough to determine much of anything at that age. Temper tantrums and fits of bad behaviour do not a bad child make. The parents and peers play a large part too.
There are quite a few factors involved which might require study for a long time.
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| Bah!! | Jan 28th. at 12:46:50 pm EST
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Klarynn (Apache Junction, Arizona) - Email Me
What a bunch of hooey!!.... I seriously doubt that if we were to screen kids we would be able to determine anything resolute. This reminds me of minority report.... Sure next lets arrest people for thinking about hurting someone..
Bah!
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| Aren't Parents Role Models For Their Kids Anymore? | Jan 28th. at 12:03:19 pm EST
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Moonlight Wolf (Bradford, England) - Email Me
The whole part of the article that got me was the fact it never mentioned parental roles.
I'll admit it, I was a horrible kid to raise, tantrums, violence, selfishness, you name it but I am happy to say I am not like that now. The reason for this is my parents refused to let my behaviour become the norm. If I did something bad I got punished.
A kid that has tantrums and is violent as a kid will not necessarily turn into a criminal providing the parents teach them that their own selfish behaviour is not acceptable and will not be tolerated.
Kids whose parents let bad behaviour continue are the ones who will end up being criminals.
It's not just behaviour its how it is dealt with as well.
As The Children's Society believes 'No child is beyond hope, understanding or love.'
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