| 
|
Page: Profile: Wren's Nest News Local
| Total Views: 4,943,434
|
Article: 16628
[Civil]
Date Posted:
11/20/2006
6:18:53 pm EST
Wvox Stats
Views: 5,895
RSS: 22,281
Comments: 6
|
Religious Classes Making Move
Author: Hannah Lodge Source: Reporter-Times (IN)
Title: RELIGIOUS CLASSES MAKING MOVE
The Weekday Religious Education class that sparked a lawsuit against the Mooresville school system has been permanently moved off school property, said Curt Freeman, superintendent of the Mooresville Consolidated School Corporation.
A Mooresville mother, in conjunction with the American Civil Liberties Union, brought a lawsuit against the MCSC on Oct. 11 for letting students at Neil Armstrong Elementary School attend a religious education program on school property during school hours.
The program, which is in 16 schools in Morgan County, requires parental permission for third- and fourth-grade students to leave the classroom for about an hour once a week to receive Bible education, according to the suit.
| Options: [Read Full Story] [Comments Locked]
[Email to a Friend]
|
|
Community Thoughts: There are 6 comments posted | Reverse Sort |
| How Asinine | Nov 21st. at 10:14:13 pm EST
|
Sickle (Mt. Jackson, Virginia) - Email Me - Web
I went to elementary school from 1985 to 1989, and during that time we had the "Bible Bus." It was an old school bus modified so that students could be seated in regular chairs or sit on the floor. On the Bible Bus, we colored, drew pictures, played games, and listened to stories, all of which I loved. We had to have it on a bus because someone complained about having it in the school itself.
Here I am, nearly twenty years later, an ordained Wiccan priest, and I still feel nostalgic for that Bible Bus. We were not drilled into being mindless drones, or "arrows of God." We were not told to hate others (quite the contrary) because they weren't Xians. We enjoyed doing what children do, but with the flavoring of Xianity.
I think it is pathetic for someone to raise such a fuss about this. Sure, some children will be left out and feel ostracized. That's life! The fat kids get left out of kickball (I know, as that fat kid was me) , and the non-Xians don't go to the religious class.
Everytime someone makes an issue about something as little as this, people start to whine. Is it possible for us, as a collective, to act like adults?
|
| Education V. Indoctrination | Nov 21st. at 10:20:38 am EST
|
Terry (Irvington, Virginia) - Email Me
If this program were actual religious education, it would be an excellent thing to have on school grounds during the school day, led by school personnel (so long as they found competent teachers, who might be a scarce resource in a rural bible belt region) . Given that kids in this age range aren't about to indulge in comparative theologies of world religions, they might approach it by teaching meditation and yoga as health and stress management practices, do nature hikes and discuss whether gods were something one could see or if they might be present in the trees, set up shrines or altars of different relgions and compare the elements of them to historic art, or visit a circus and arrange to ride elephants and see how animals are managed behind the scenes. There should be no parental permission for that, as it would be education, "hands on" experience based in order to be age appropriate. That education would serve a valid public purpose for having public schools (versus not having them, or trusting parents to educate kids) , filling in gaps where no one or two parents are fully capable of teaching kids worldly knowledge useful to function in a massively diverse society, while many parents are active abusers by negligent or intentional actions which deprive kids of serious religious and overlapping cultural education needed to become aware, responsible adults in a participatory democracy of many demographics.
The reason for parental permission for this program is that it amounts to psychological cult indoctrination with massive potential for abuse. It's not an "education" program at all, other than in rabid fundie "code speak", designed to produce mind numbed little robots indoctrinated to not think outside a small box grossly inadequate to be a responsible adult in this modern world.
The problem in a school system where 89% of parents sign their kids into an illegal school hosted cult indoctrination scheme is with the parents and voters. It's not primarily a question of where the trailers are located, and in that sense the ACLU is taking on only the easy issues where school provided subsidies for religious cult indoctrination misrepresented as if education is way over the legal line. The tricky question is whether 89% of local parents are acting in ways that rightfully constitute child abuse, which the school system should not schedule or accommodate during school hours at all, with or without permission slips. That overdue legal challenge requires changing a very messy body of case law, which would have to address remnants of slavery where kids are still treated largely as if chattel property, where alternatives such as tribal communes would break down larger social and family models, as kids do need support systems of some kind. That overdue legal challenge calls for a serious inspection of how societal "Fact" has shifted, such that the institutionalized bigotry of most supremacist cults has become increasingly at odds with functional needs of adults in our diverse society, but over issues which the government isn't entitled to regulate other than over narrow issues of serious public consequence. In a region where 89% of parents may actually think cult indoctrination is education, changing that deeply ingrained bigotry as a presumed universal social norm would be an incredible challenge, which the local ACLU may be reluctant to tackle, if they even look beyond messy case law to larger issues of that type at all.
That's exactly the type of community where a _real_ religious education program could do the most good for students, if administrators and school board could manage to diplomatically garner support of many parents and deal with the hissy fits from others. Contrary to common practice, a real RE program is something which parents should not be allowed to opt kids out of, as learning about alternatives to supremacist hate cults is a compelling government interest based on the demands for voters and jurors to act responsibly, in addition to understanding the nature of economics and markets in diverse national and global economies.
It would be interesting to create real RE programs and demand they be offered with equal access in these schools (even if by time out of the school day for off campus meetings) . What percentage of the 11% now opting out, and the 89% going to cardboard poster painted Jee-Zus camp, would sign up for actual education in religions? The odds are that offering such a program would go the next step the ACLU isn't touching, and take the church abuse time slot out of the school day, which would have the effect of testing which smaller percentage of the 89% would attend after school cult indoctrination programs not coordinated with the school at all, versus simply not attending. It's likely such a tactic would be more effective in ending the school scheduled cult sessions than litigation. Ultimately our so-called justice system is broken until we do tackle those larger and very problematic issues in core legal precedents. Can anyone find tactics to do so, prior to flushing psychotics like Scalia who believe law is rigidly fixed in the societal demographics of the 18th century off the courts?
|
| Still Wrong. | Nov 21st. at 9:04:03 am EST
|
BlueManticore (Tinley Park, Illinois) - Email Me
This is still wrong if they are going to continue using up public school time to teach religion. If they want to continue with these classes, the need to do it off of public school grounds and AFTER public school is over for the day. Using an hour of time during the school day to teach religion when they should be teaching math or science, etc. is still wrong, even if it is not on public school grounds or by public school personnel or using public school materials. Public school time should be used for public school lessons, not religion lessons..
|
| They Need To Do This Some Other Time. | Nov 20th. at 9:13:58 pm EST
|
bigcat (peoria, Illinois) - Email Me
I think they need to work on the time. After all, they are still using school time for this. They need to do this when it doesn't interfere with classroom work-- like on Sunday, when other churches are operating.
|
| Still Doesn't Solve The Problem | Nov 20th. at 7:45:47 pm EST
|
Bookworm (Saint Paul, Minnesota) - Email Me
If I remember correctly, the problem was that kids who didn't participate were feeling ostracized, and that instead of being given an alternate class, they were left to sit in the library while the other students were in Bible class. So now they've moving the instruction off of school property, and making pretend that the public school and the Bible ed people have nothing to do with each other, but it looks like they are still using up publicly-funded instructional time for kids to go to the Bible class. Allowing the kids who opted out to do homework during that period is not compensating them for the lost instructional time. Frankly, I think that's a bigger problem than using the property. The parents who want religious ed for their kids shouldn't be relying on public school time to get that done. There are plenty of afterschool, Sunday, and summer programs offered by churches, not to mention private religious schools.
|
| A Little Far | Nov 20th. at 7:12:56 pm EST
|
Ahr-Ohn (Bridgeport, Connecticut) - Email Me
"—School personnel cannot meet with WRE personnel to review the program.
—The school cannot transport or walk students from one facility to the other.
—WRE material must state the program is not affiliated with the Mooresville Consolidated School Corporation."
Does everything not associated with Mooresville Consolidated School Corporation have to say so, explicitly? Those of us who are not associated with the Mooresville Consolidated School Corporation would like to know.
I don't think it would be legal, for teachers to let these students off-campus, without escort. Whatever happened to In-Loco-Parentis?
They wouldn't have to be going overboard, unless there's a perception of prior malfeasance.
All they really had to do, was advise the parents as to what was being taught in Weekday Religious Education, and three quarters, at least, would object.
Did Jesus ever ask to be worshipped, or was that just added by the Persecution?
Arawn
|
Disclaimer: The Witches' Voice inc does not verify the accuracy of the details stated in this listing, nor do we vouch for the value of the goods or services presented here... As with all contacts and financial dealings in cyberspace, we encourage you to use caution and wisdom in your dealings with strangers.
Political Statements: Any and all personal political opinions expressed in the public listing sections (including, but not restricted to, personals, events, groups, shops, Wren's Nest, etc.) are solely those of the author(s) and do not reflect the opinion of The Witches' Voice, Inc. TWV is a non-profit, non-partisan educational organization.
|
State/Country flags created by 3dflags.com and are used with permission
Web Site Content (including: text - graphics - html - look & feel)
Copyright 1997-2009 The Witches' Voice Inc. All rights reserved
Note: Authors & Artists retain the copyright for their work(s) on this website.
Unauthorized reproduction without prior permission is a violation of copyright laws.
Website structure, evolution and php coding by Fritz Jung on a Macintosh G5.
Any and all personal political opinions expressed in the public listing sections (including, but not restricted to, personals, events, groups, shops, Wren’s Nest, etc.) are solely those of the author(s) and do not reflect the opinion of The Witches’ Voice, Inc. TWV is a nonprofit, nonpartisan educational organization.
Sponsorship: Visit the Witches' Voice Sponsor Page for info on how you
can help support this Community Resource. Donations ARE Tax Deductible.
The Witches' Voice carries a 501(c)(3) certificate and a Federal Tax ID.
Mail Us: The Witches' Voice Inc., P.O. Box 341018, Tampa, Florida 33694-1018 U.S.A.
| |
